Grave concern over the safety of Lauren Spierer has overcome the Indiana University Campus in Bloomington since the twenty year old disappeared early Friday morning. Two searches have taken place, so far all of no avail. (Head basketball coach Tom Crean participated in one of the searches as did numerous other members of the faculty.) Police are seeking any information about Lauren's whereabouts.
This 20 year-old blond woman is a 2009 graduate of Edgemont High School in Scarsdale, N.Y. She is currently a junior at Indiana University studying fashion merchandising. She was taking a summer class in Bloomington at Ivy Tech. She was last seen leaving Kilroy Sports bar on Friday early in the morning, wearing black pants, a white shirt and no shoes. According to the Indiana Daily-Student, Spierer lived only a block and a half away from Kilroy's. Her known locations that early morning were all within a three block radius of her Smallwood apartment. Video from the apartment complex is consistent with Lauren never reaching her apartment. Indiana Daily-Student
Lauren is described as a 90 lbs, 4 feet, 11 inches tall blond with blue eyes. She was last wearing a white tank top with a light-colored shirt over it and black pants. foxnews.com Any tips should be forwarded to the Bloomington Police Department, (812) 339-4477.
Update 6-8-11: Still not much more information on Lauren. However, in Arizona a somewhat similar abduction may have taken place. Kristian Faith Ward, an 18-year-old model and mother has been missing since late last month. Ward (aka Kristian Faith Stout), was last seen walking away from the Paradise Valley Mall in Phoenix on May 27. Phoenix Police Department. Ward apparently picked up her check at the mall and then subsequently disappeared without a trace. (The search for Kristian Faith Ward from Phoenix, Ariz., ended with the young woman's safe recovery, according to her father. Her father said,"This is a matter of family privacy and we thank you for all of your concern and prayers." Let's all pray that the search for Lauren Spierer ends in a similar result.)
Update 6-9-11: In today's age of video surveillance, the chances of getting to the truth have increased several fold. Corey Rossman, an IU student, had been with Lauren Spierer a few hours before her disappearance. Corey was apparently punched by another man or men near Lauren's apartment. "At Smallwood, someone confronted them... He got punched in the face. He has no memory of that, or of the 15 minutes leading to that moment...” said Corey's attorney, Carl Salzmann.
Rossman has cooperated. He and Lauren were seen on videotape returning to her residence around 2:30 a.m. They then left the building about 10 minutes later. Lauren was helping Rossman go home because Rossman had been punched. The couple went to Rossman's building complex. Lauren apparently visited another apartment at the complex. There may have been another “confrontation” that morning at Rossman’s building; however, this officially remains speculation.
Lauren is described as a 90 lbs, 4 feet, 11 inches tall blond with blue eyes. She was last wearing a white tank top with a light-colored shirt over it and black pants. foxnews.com Any tips should be forwarded to the Bloomington Police Department, (812) 339-4477.
Update 6-8-11: Still not much more information on Lauren. However, in Arizona a somewhat similar abduction may have taken place. Kristian Faith Ward, an 18-year-old model and mother has been missing since late last month. Ward (aka Kristian Faith Stout), was last seen walking away from the Paradise Valley Mall in Phoenix on May 27. Phoenix Police Department. Ward apparently picked up her check at the mall and then subsequently disappeared without a trace. (The search for Kristian Faith Ward from Phoenix, Ariz., ended with the young woman's safe recovery, according to her father. Her father said,"This is a matter of family privacy and we thank you for all of your concern and prayers." Let's all pray that the search for Lauren Spierer ends in a similar result.)
Update 6-9-11: In today's age of video surveillance, the chances of getting to the truth have increased several fold. Corey Rossman, an IU student, had been with Lauren Spierer a few hours before her disappearance. Corey was apparently punched by another man or men near Lauren's apartment. "At Smallwood, someone confronted them... He got punched in the face. He has no memory of that, or of the 15 minutes leading to that moment...” said Corey's attorney, Carl Salzmann.
Rossman has cooperated. He and Lauren were seen on videotape returning to her residence around 2:30 a.m. They then left the building about 10 minutes later. Lauren was helping Rossman go home because Rossman had been punched. The couple went to Rossman's building complex. Lauren apparently visited another apartment at the complex. There may have been another “confrontation” that morning at Rossman’s building; however, this officially remains speculation.
It is reported that Spierer was last seen rounding a corner on her way back to her apartment at about 4:15 to 4:30 a.m according to Jay Rosenbaum. (Cory Rossman was apparently not the last one to see Spierer that morning. Perhaps as many as three or four other people may have seen Lauren after Cory Rossman went to bed.) Video footage from security cameras back at Lauren’s apartment building (Smallwood) suggest that she may have argued with several men that morning. One can expect police will get to the bottom of this matter. Lauren's father is offering a $100,000 reward for information concerning his daughter.
Afternoon update: Crystal Grubb disappeared last September in Bloomington. Crystal's body was found after 13 days in a cornfield just outside of Bloomington. Her homicide remains unsolved; however, information has leaked out that her purse may have been found near one of the apartment buildings in question. If that is true, there may be link between the Crystal's murder and Lauren's disappearance. In the mean time, it has also been reported that Rossman's car, credit card and cell phone have been examined by the police for possible information. Police continue to say that Lauren was not herself involved in the altercation with the other men and that Rossman has cooperated. Spierer apparently met Cory Rossman recently at the Indianapolis 500 track.
Update 6-10-11: Here is more information about the altercation which occurred at the fifth floor lobby of Spierer's apartment. Cory Rossman apparently recently met Spierer at the Indy 500 track. He was not close with Lauren's circle of friends. Apparently, Rossman was punched in the face in the 5th floor elevator lobby by someone who may know Spierer's boyfriend. (The puncher is rumored to be Zach Oakes but his identity has not been officially released.) Spierer's boyfriend, Jesse Wolff, a 22 year old IU student from Port Washington, New York, was not present at the time of the altercation. (The person who hit Rossman may or may not be one of Wolff's friends. Wolff was reportedly at home watching basketball at the time of the altercation.) After the altercation at Smallwood Apartments, Rossman and Spierer then apparently walked to Rossman's apartment near 11th and Morton. Rossman was allegedly put to bed by his roommate (Mike Beth.) Beth was reportedly sober as he had been up late working on a term paper. Beth said that Spierer left his apartment and went to see another friend. (This is believed to be Jay Rosenbaum of West Bloomfield, MI.) Spierer reportedly left the North Townhomes apartments around 4:30 a.m. Keys and a purse were apparently found on the route between North Townhomes and Smallwood. According to today's police press conference, Parker said surveillance video from nearby businesses may show some cars in the area at the time she disappeared. Investigators are working to identify the vehicles.
Update Afternoon 6-10-11: Nothing specific on Spierer; however, Plainfield, Indiana police are seeking information on Morgan Johnson, 27, who may be in need of medical attention. Morgan Johnson, 27, was last seen on May 18th at the Value Place hotel on Gateway Drive in Plainfield. Johnson has not made any phone calls on his cell phone or made any financial transactions. He drives a white 1995 Pontiac Grand Am, license plate # JS1830. Anyone with information on Morgan Johnson's whereabouts should call the Plainfield Police Department at 317-839-2566. Ironic that Lauren's case generated so much publicity but Morgan's did not.
Update 6-12-11: The Spierer investigation continues. Bloomington attorney Ron Chapman represents Mike Beth, a roommate of Corey Rossman. Chapman says Beth was at home doing classwork the early morning when Spierer disappeared. He says Beth is cooperating "totally and completely" with police. Both Mike Beth and Cory Rossman have apparently given police DNA samples.
Update 6-13-11: While the T.V. show generated tips, still no Lauren. The family has set up a website: www.findlauren.com. In the meantime, can the police publicly confirm the identity of the man in the alley captured on surveillance? (Is it indeed Rossman getting walked back from the altercation by Spierer?) See the following quote: "Surveillance video also shows Lauren in an alley walking with an acquaintance on the morning she disappeared. The alley is the same place where her keys and coin purse were found by authorities." Confirm the name of the man and provide a description and photo of the vehicles seen on video. Let the public see if they know anything about the whereabouts of this man (and perhaps of the vehicles) during the 24 hours after Lauren disappeared.
Update Afternoon 6-10-11: Nothing specific on Spierer; however, Plainfield, Indiana police are seeking information on Morgan Johnson, 27, who may be in need of medical attention. Morgan Johnson, 27, was last seen on May 18th at the Value Place hotel on Gateway Drive in Plainfield. Johnson has not made any phone calls on his cell phone or made any financial transactions. He drives a white 1995 Pontiac Grand Am, license plate # JS1830. Anyone with information on Morgan Johnson's whereabouts should call the Plainfield Police Department at 317-839-2566. Ironic that Lauren's case generated so much publicity but Morgan's did not.
Update 6-12-11: The Spierer investigation continues. Bloomington attorney Ron Chapman represents Mike Beth, a roommate of Corey Rossman. Chapman says Beth was at home doing classwork the early morning when Spierer disappeared. He says Beth is cooperating "totally and completely" with police. Both Mike Beth and Cory Rossman have apparently given police DNA samples.
Update 6-13-11: While the T.V. show generated tips, still no Lauren. The family has set up a website: www.findlauren.com. In the meantime, can the police publicly confirm the identity of the man in the alley captured on surveillance? (Is it indeed Rossman getting walked back from the altercation by Spierer?) See the following quote: "Surveillance video also shows Lauren in an alley walking with an acquaintance on the morning she disappeared. The alley is the same place where her keys and coin purse were found by authorities." Confirm the name of the man and provide a description and photo of the vehicles seen on video. Let the public see if they know anything about the whereabouts of this man (and perhaps of the vehicles) during the 24 hours after Lauren disappeared.
Here is what Legal Pub thinks may be an APPROPRIATE TIMELINE:12:16 a.m. While still at Smallwood, Lauren last uses her cell phone.
12:30 a.m. Hadar Tamir, Spierer's roommate at Smallwood, was hanging out with Lauren until then. Lauren then apparently went with David Rohn, to Jay Rosenbaum's apartment at North Townhomes. Rossman apparently joined Spierer at Rosenbaum's apartment. Next, Rossman apparently went with Spierer to Kilroy's Sports Bar.2:25, Lauren and Rossman leave the bar but Lauren leaves behind her shoes and cell phone. Spierer and Corey Rossman (who lives at 5 North Townhomes) walked to Lauren's apartment complex arriving around 2:30 a.m.
Around 2:30 a.m., Jesse Wolff, Speirer's boyfriend says that he went to sleep in his apartment after watching basketball and not being able to reach Lauren Spierer by phone.
At 2:45 a.m., Rossman apparently exchanges words and perhaps a punch with some possible aquaintences of Jesse Wolff (Spierer's boyfriend.) The puncher is rumored to be Zach Oakes but that has not been confirmed. The confrontation takes place in the 5th floor elevator lobby of Spierer's apartment building. (Rossman apparently has no memory of the fight or the walk back to his apartment.)
Around 2:55, Spierer begins walking Cory Rossman home. (Just before 3:00 a.m. is apparently the last video confirmation of Lauren by the alley. It was also reported that this was near the area where a key was found. (Note Ajay A. may have been the one to find a single key around 3:00 a.m. Note, there are later reports that Spierer's keys were found on a railing near Rosenbaum's apartment at 5 North Townhomes. A poster here says that a wrist-let that carried her key, key card, and ID was seen by A.A., a friend, that morning around 3 a.m. Later that morning, 2 females (one interviewed in MSM), apparently picked up the key and one of them turned it in to law enforcement.)
Around 3:10, the couple should have arrived at Cory Rossman's apartment. Rossman's roommate, Mike Beth, claims he put Rossman to bed. Beth says he was sober and up late working on a paper. Spierer allegedly wanted to keep on partying so she apparently left Rossman's apartment to visit Jay Rosenbaum. Rosenbaum lived two doors down.
At 3:38 a bar manager allegedly sees a woman who looks like Spierer with what appears to be a darker skinned man in the alley. (Source TonyGatto.com.) Police discount the witnesses testimony based on a lack of video confirmation. ( The bar manager witness who apparently came forward and told the police that she saw an intoxicated Spierer at 3:38 a.m. at 10th and College with an unidentified man was also discredited by Bloomington police apparently because of a lack of video confirmation.)
At 4:15 a.m. there is a phone call from Rosenbaum's cell phone to David Rohn's phone which apparently goes unanswered. Rosenbaum says that it was Lauren calling David Rohn to see if he knew where her phone was located. Rosenbaum reportedly told police Spierer left the apartment complex at approximately 4:30 a.m. to walk home. (It is possible that she may have left Rosenbaum's as early as 4:16.) Rosenbaum claims that he last saw her near 11th Street and College Avenue but there is apparently no video proof of her presence.
Around 2:55, Spierer begins walking Cory Rossman home. (Just before 3:00 a.m. is apparently the last video confirmation of Lauren by the alley. It was also reported that this was near the area where a key was found. (Note Ajay A. may have been the one to find a single key around 3:00 a.m. Note, there are later reports that Spierer's keys were found on a railing near Rosenbaum's apartment at 5 North Townhomes. A poster here says that a wrist-let that carried her key, key card, and ID was seen by A.A., a friend, that morning around 3 a.m. Later that morning, 2 females (one interviewed in MSM), apparently picked up the key and one of them turned it in to law enforcement.)
Around 3:10, the couple should have arrived at Cory Rossman's apartment. Rossman's roommate, Mike Beth, claims he put Rossman to bed. Beth says he was sober and up late working on a paper. Spierer allegedly wanted to keep on partying so she apparently left Rossman's apartment to visit Jay Rosenbaum. Rosenbaum lived two doors down.
At 3:38 a bar manager allegedly sees a woman who looks like Spierer with what appears to be a darker skinned man in the alley. (Source TonyGatto.com.) Police discount the witnesses testimony based on a lack of video confirmation. ( The bar manager witness who apparently came forward and told the police that she saw an intoxicated Spierer at 3:38 a.m. at 10th and College with an unidentified man was also discredited by Bloomington police apparently because of a lack of video confirmation.)
At 4:15 a.m. there is a phone call from Rosenbaum's cell phone to David Rohn's phone which apparently goes unanswered. Rosenbaum says that it was Lauren calling David Rohn to see if he knew where her phone was located. Rosenbaum reportedly told police Spierer left the apartment complex at approximately 4:30 a.m. to walk home. (It is possible that she may have left Rosenbaum's as early as 4:16.) Rosenbaum claims that he last saw her near 11th Street and College Avenue but there is apparently no video proof of her presence.
At 4:24 a.m., what appears to be a white four door Sierra circles the block. Police say they checked out the owner of the vehicle. (The 4:24 sighting of what was described as a white Silverado or Colorado truck captured on video has been declared not related by Bloomington police.)
(NOTE: while police say that "a neighbor of Rossman" say that Spierer was last seen around 4:30 a.m., police apparently have no video confirmation of Lauren at that time. It is assumed that "the neighbor" who gave this statement is Jay Rosenbaum.)
4:30 a.m. There is an unconfirmed report that a homeless man heard a scream.7:30: Later Friday Morning: Allegedly the trash dumpsters were emptied on Friday before 8:00 a.m.
7:45 Jesse Wolff apparently gets up and takes a roommate to his 8:00 a.m. class.
Later that morning: Wolff apparently texts Lauren without any answer. Killroys apparently texts back to "tell your friend her phone is here." Wolff contacts Hadar Tamir to get Lauren's keys to see if Lauren is still in her apartment. Wolfe enters the apartment in the afternoon. Wolff apparently calls Lauren's parents to say she is missing. Sara and Amanda Roude fill out some type of missing person's report with the Bloomington police. (It appears that Lauren was reported missing within 12 hours of her last alleged sighting.) Unconfirmed reports also describe a possible confrontation between Wolff and Jay Rosenbaum on that Friday.
7:45 Jesse Wolff apparently gets up and takes a roommate to his 8:00 a.m. class.
Later that morning: Wolff apparently texts Lauren without any answer. Killroys apparently texts back to "tell your friend her phone is here." Wolff contacts Hadar Tamir to get Lauren's keys to see if Lauren is still in her apartment. Wolfe enters the apartment in the afternoon. Wolff apparently calls Lauren's parents to say she is missing. Sara and Amanda Roude fill out some type of missing person's report with the Bloomington police. (It appears that Lauren was reported missing within 12 hours of her last alleged sighting.) Unconfirmed reports also describe a possible confrontation between Wolff and Jay Rosenbaum on that Friday.
Representation: Persons of interest have legal representation and thus direct access to them is not possible. Rosenbaum is represented by attorney James Voyles. Wolff is being represented by Joe Lozano. Wolff met Spierer in summer camp as a child. They have been dating for a couple of years. Wolff, is reported to have spent the evening watching basketball and unsuccessfully attempting to reach Spierer by text. Wolff allegedly went to bed in his residence at 2:30 p.m. Wolff did track down Spierer's roommate (Hadar Tamir) the next day. She gave him keys to the apartment where he confirmed Lauren was missing. Wolff apparently called Lauren's parents to tell them he could not find Lauren. Wolff is believed to be back in his home town of Port Washington, New York. Jay Rosenbaum is believed to be back at home in West Bloomfield, Michigan. Cory Rossman and Mike Beth apparently remain in Bloomington going about their normal lives.
All person's of interest are to be presumed innocent!
Update 6-14-11: Rumors persist that Lauren Spierer may have overdosed on cocaine and alcohol. If Lauren (who had a heart condition) really did die of an overdose (and those with her panicked and disposed of her body) then those folks should come forward to authorities with the truth. Mike Beth's attorney denies that there is any truth to the rumor of some type of coverup. KEEP IN MIND AT THIS POINT, RUMORS ARE MERELY RUMORS AND NOT FACT.
From the video, a more accurate description of Lauren's clothing is as follows: "A V-neck white shirt that may have had a "distressed" look, with elbow-length butterfly sleeves and a scooped bottom. She also wore black leggings with silver zippers at the ankles." With regard to the timeline, video from an alley between Smallwood and Rossman's apartment showed them walking toward his building around 3 a.m. Keys were later found in that alley. A neighbor of Rossman reported seeing Spierer leave around 4:30 a.m., but police have no video confirmation of Spierer after the 3 a.m.
Update 6-15-11: Equisearch was in town adding firepower to the search for Lauren Spierer. Legal Pub also had a presence in Bloomington. There is a construction project underway that seemed like a logical place to search. Many dumpsters in the area are regularly emptied and the contents taken to a land fill in another city. Presumably the police have alerted the landfill in question. The bottom line is that if Lauren got into a motor vehicle, then the search area is vast. For example, Bloomington and the surrounding rural areas have many wooded areas and bodies of water. The further one travels away from Bloomington, the more rural the area. While rumors of an accidental death persist, there is little evidence to substantiate many of the claims. Foul play is not always the culprit. One can't help but recall the missing Purdue student, Wade Steffey, who was later found dead after he stumbled into a high voltage area. Key questions to a few persons of interest and locating the drivers of one or two vehicles in the area could possibly lead to locating Lauren Spierer. Unfortunately, a prompt resolution is not in sight.
Legal Pub would welcome the opportunity to get input directly from Hadar Tamir. She can reach us at legalpub@legalpub.net. Of interest is Hadar's statement that Lauren Spierer used Rosenbaum's phone to call David Rhon at 4:15 a.m. that morning to see if he knew the whereabouts of her cell phone. Rhon has apparently cooperated with police.
Finally photos of the white pickup truck and of Lauren at the apartment have been released. See top of page. We still need photos of the last confirmed sighting and a public confirmation who was with her in the photos. Knowing all of the people who were at Rosenbaum's that early morning would also be helpful.
Update 6-16-11: Apparently the purse found belonged to a former homicide victim Angela Holder not Crystal Grubb. Holder was a 39 year old resident who worked at the Scottish Inn. She apparently argued with her boyfriend and was found stabbed to death in her residence on June 7, 2011. Bruce Edward Foster has been arrested on charges of murder arising out of what is believed to be a crime of passion.
LINK Another photo of the truck is posted above. There is another surveillance photo of Lauren that police have not released. Police won't say if there is anyone else in the photo!
Update 6-17-11: A search warrant was apparently obtained in the Spierer case to search the Republic Sycamore Ridge Landfill in Pimento Indiana. Police have not yet acted on the warant. In the mean time, police are following up on leads concerning the white Colorado or Silverado truck in the photos. Apparently the truck circled the block and when it left, it failed to stop for a stop sign. Some one, some where, knows about an acquaintance who was driving a white truck in Bloomington, Indiana in the early morning hours of June 3, 2011! In an unrelated case, Carley Jean Lewis, the missing 16 year-old girl from Michigan was found dead. An acquaintance of Carley, Robert Jensen Schwander, is charged with "Open Murder."
Afternoon 6-17-11: The end game would seem near with the reported sighting at 3:38 at 10th and College. According to an unidentified witness believed to be a bar manager, a drunk Spierer was apparently seen with a man who at one point put Lauren over his shoulder. According to the witness, the darker skinned man does not look like any of the person's of interest. The witness allegedly told TonyGatto.com that Lauren appeared very intoxicated. Lauren may have even hit her head in the encounter. (Why has this witness not come forward sooner? Is she credible? Why have the police not released the rest of the video? Why does her timeline (3:38 sighting) apparently conflict with Rosenbaum's statement? Police apparently believe that this bar manager's recollection of time is erroneous.) In perhaps a completely unrelated manner, there are reports of a bag of man and woman's clothes being found in a dumpster behind Lauren's apartment. The clothing supposedly has nothing to do with the Spierer case; however, authorities do not always tell the public everything. Police took no questions today at their police conference.
Afternoon 6-17-11: The end game would seem near with the reported sighting at 3:38 at 10th and College. According to an unidentified witness believed to be a bar manager, a drunk Spierer was apparently seen with a man who at one point put Lauren over his shoulder. According to the witness, the darker skinned man does not look like any of the person's of interest. The witness allegedly told TonyGatto.com that Lauren appeared very intoxicated. Lauren may have even hit her head in the encounter. (Why has this witness not come forward sooner? Is she credible? Why have the police not released the rest of the video? Why does her timeline (3:38 sighting) apparently conflict with Rosenbaum's statement? Police apparently believe that this bar manager's recollection of time is erroneous.) In perhaps a completely unrelated manner, there are reports of a bag of man and woman's clothes being found in a dumpster behind Lauren's apartment. The clothing supposedly has nothing to do with the Spierer case; however, authorities do not always tell the public everything. Police took no questions today at their police conference.
Update 6-20-11: Without tips, the search for Lauren must depend upon luck. The search has expanded to outlying areas. It is reasonable to believe that a bridge, wooded area and water area off of highway 37 was recently searched near Martinsville. Apparently nothing of significance was recovered. It is also reasonable to assume that the police have followed up on leads on what is believed to be a 2006 to 2007 Chevy Silverado 1500 with fancy wheels, black handles and a black protector over the bed rails. Officially, the search continues. It remains difficult to reconcile the bar manager's alleged 3:38 sighting of Lauren with a dark skinned man at 11th and college with Rosenbaum's story that he last saw her at 4:30 a.m.
Police visited the owner of the white truck and he has cooperated fully. Police conclude that he was not involved in the Spierer incident. He was picking up a worker in an area with lots of construction. Police are satisfied with the man's explanation. Law enforcement also indicates that the clothes found by the dumpster at Smallwood are not related to the case. Finally, the search near Martinsville did not turn up anything. Assuming the police information is accurate, given no video evidence of Spierer after 2:45, the focus most likely will shift back to what happened at Rosenbaum's apartment complex. Keep in mind, that David Rohn was quoted early on to the effect that he was with Lauren early in the evening at a friends (presumably Rosenbaum's apartment.) Then he went back to Smallwood and she presumably went to Sports. (Fox 59 video.) If David Rohn mentions the 4:15 call Rosenbaum says Lauren made on his phone to David Rohn, I can't find Rohn's comments in the press. An attorney has said that Rohn was asleep and the call went unanswered. David Rohn participated in the search on 6-5-11 and gave a voluntary statement to Fox 59. Police say that Rossman, Beth, Rosenbaum, Rohn and Wolff have cooperated. Just what was the 4:15 call all about and who said what?Update 6-21-11: Try not to be too critical of law enforcement. It is not just the Bloomington police department. The U.S. Marshall's office, the FBI and the Indiana State police are all involved to some extent. By way of clarification, the official explanation of the white truck is as follows: "The owner of the truck was driving in that location, an area with a lot of construction, to pick up a worker."The driver has been interrogated and law enforcement is confident that the pickup was not involved in the disappearance of Lauren Spierer. As for those calling for a further interrogation of certain person's of interest, there is no way at to make them speak further. Upon advice of counsel, they are unlikely to give any further statements. That does not in any way make them guilty. In fact, they are presumed innocent. Finally, the bar manager's story is a continued source of investigation. Keep in mind, it is a process that tries to rule theories out. Other surveillance footage in other parts of Bloomington may be helpful to track vehicle movement; however, there appears to be no video surveillance at 5 North Townhomes complex where Lauren Spierer apparently last visited before her disappearance.
Update 6-22-11: Police will hold a briefing today. While they may take few questions, here are what we believe are the "probable answers" to questions that our readers have been asking:
1. Comments are still posted, but to read them, you must got to the bottom of the comments and click on "newer posts."
2. You may assume that Bloomington police have access to Rosenbaum's and Rohn's phone records. This is possible through consent and through subpoena.
3. You may also assume that law enforcement knows whether or not the 4:15 a.m. caller left a message. If one was left, rest assured it has been reviewed.
4. There are no reports as to the degree of inebriation (if any) of Rosenbaum or Rohn. Assumptions that Rohn or Rosenbaum were "wasted" etc are rank speculation at this point.
5. Mike Beth and Rossman appear to have gone out of their way to cooperate. They remain in Bloomington. It was Beth who said Lauren left to go to Rosenbaum's and that turned out to be true.
6. Lauren's keys were reportedly found on a rail near Rosenbaum's apartment. The exact location has not been reported. Keep in mind, Rossman and Beth live two doors down from Rosenbaum. It is possible Lauren never possessed the keys at Rosenbaum's apartment or that she could have lost them in transition. We do know that Rosenbaum is the last person to report that he was with Lauren and that was shortly before 4:30.
7. Surveillance cameras, if motion activated, tend to detect larger objects. Depending on their settings, Lauren would not necessarily be considered a "larger object."
8. Law enforcement has much more information then what they are releasing to the public. The public has "no right to know." On the other hand, when information might help lead to a resolution, law enforcement releases the information.
9. Until they find Lauren, they do not have a cause of death. If her death was arrhythmia induced from consumption of illegal drugs, then suppliers of those drugs could faces charges UNLESS they cooperate with the State and enter into a deal. Keep in mind, no drug use is confirmed at this point.
10. Once a person of interest is identified as a true person of interest, they tend to remain watched even if they leave town. U.S. Marshall's and FBI are involved...
11. This is a process of elimination. Many theories have already been ruled out. Be a little patient. Retaining legal counsel is smart and not a sign of guilt. Find Lauren and the rest will follow...
Update 6-23-11: Yesterday's press conference revealed nothing that has not already been discussed. While Lauren's parents are disappointed in the number of tips and the less then 50 people who showed up for the most recent search, the overall suport for finding Lauren and the truth has been just short of remarkable. While this tragic event has forever changed the Speirer's life, life must go on. Unless Lauren's body wound up in a landfill, eventually she will be found. Perhaps, only then will some answers become apparent.
As for who was at Rosenbaum's apartment that early morning, one suspects that the official response is likely as follows: Early that morning, Lauren and David Rohn were apparently at Jay Rosenbaum's apartment. Cory Rossman joined them at Rosenbaum's. Rossman and Lauren then left to go to Sports. Lauren and Rossman went to Smallwood, where Rossman got punched. Rossmman and Lauren then apparently returned to Rossman's apartment where he was put to bed by Mike Beth. Lauren then went over to Rosenbaum's. I have seen no evidence that Beth was ever at Rosenbaum's apartment that early morning . (Another blog claims Beth was present prior to Lauren and Rossman visiting Sports. ) There is no official report of anyone else having been present at Rosenbaum's when Lauren was last present. However, it is certainly possible that someone else was present as suggested by Cory Rossman's attorney. Perhaps that person or persons identity has not been released.
Two lingering questions for Jesse Wolff's attorney may help clarify things: When does Jesse's roommates say that they last saw Jesse on June 3, 2011? Second, Did you read your client's Facebook postings?Update 6-30-11: The police search for DNA has intensified. On Wednesday, law enforcement and their K-9's sniffed inside the apartments located at Five North Complex at 11th and Morton. According to the Herald Times, Bloomington police also searched Jesse Wolff’s house in the 600 block of East Ninth Street. At the Five North apartments, they apparently searched Corey Rossman and Mike Beth's apartment. It is unknown whether they also entered Jay Rosenbaum's apartment.
Based on the released evidence, Rosenbaum was the last to admit seeing Lauren Spierer. (Another blog claims it was Mike Beth, which we believe is inaccurate.) Beth and Rossman have fully cooperated and remain in Bloomington. Jesse Wolff claims he had stayed home and was in bed. Jesse is now in New York and has not participated in the searches, either at the instruction of law enforcement or upon advice of counsel.
7. Mystery man in alley. Police have said LS last appears on video around 2:51 p.m. in the presence of a "known person." This could be CR or someone entirely different.
8. Mystery man described by bar manager at 3:38 a.m. This could be number 7 with an error in time or it could be someone completely different. Bar manager says someone looking like L.S. is drunk and thrown over the shoulder of the dark skinned, polo clad rather short individual. The bar managers testimony appears to be discounted by law enforcement at least as to the time it allegedly occurred.
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/06/22/news.qp-4391232.sto
9. A.B. and B.B. This cast of characters would be roommates of ZO. They apparently live at 10th and college. What exactly were they doing that early morning? Their involvement or lack of involvement has not been verified nor publicly released.
10. A.A. Described off the record as an all around good guy. He apparently saw LS's key around 3:00 a.m.
11. Hadar Tamir. From Roslyn Heights New York. LS roommate. A.S. is another roommate. HT is one of only a few that have openly shared thoughts with the press. Says Wolff is a great boyfriend who would never hurt LS. Indicates that LS me CR at the Indy 500 track. Labelled as a very cooperative witness.
12. D.R. A 20 year-old from New York, New York. Studying recreational sports management. Lives at Smallwood. LS allegedly called his phone using JR's phone at 4:15 am. DR was allegedly in bed and did not answer. Participates in the first searches and is labeled as cooperative. Believed to be represented by attorney Ron Chapman.
13. Homeless man. Allegedly told law enforcement that he heard a scream at around 4:30 a.m. Reports concerning this man remain sketchy and unverified. Some say this character is completely fictitious.
14. Two girls. Allegedly two girls turned in LS's key and id.
15. Owner of a white truck. First police say there our a couple of vehicles in the area and they want to check out whether the owners know anything. Later photos of a white truck are released with the information that it was near the scene at 4:24 a.m. It apparently runs a stop sign and may have circled the block. Bloomington police then release a statement that the owner of the white truck has been identified and is not involved in the LS case. The identification of the driver of the truck remain private and are not released to public. No further mention is made of the other vehicles in the area.
16. Robert and Charlene Spierer. Grieving parents. Four months and still looking for their daughter. They just want closure, not a pound of flesh.
17. Law Enforcement. Police have refused to release the last known videos of LS for reasons completely unknown. At least one person has been very critical of the investigation. (See 7-9-11 update for link.) Even the Herald Times has quotes indicating that the landfills have yet to be searched. http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/07/16/news.qp-0661144.sto
9. A.B. and B.B. This cast of characters would be roommates of ZO. They apparently live at 10th and college. What exactly were they doing that early morning? Their involvement or lack of involvement has not been verified nor publicly released.
10. A.A. Described off the record as an all around good guy. He apparently saw LS's key around 3:00 a.m.
11. Hadar Tamir. From Roslyn Heights New York. LS roommate. A.S. is another roommate. HT is one of only a few that have openly shared thoughts with the press. Says Wolff is a great boyfriend who would never hurt LS. Indicates that LS me CR at the Indy 500 track. Labelled as a very cooperative witness.
12. D.R. A 20 year-old from New York, New York. Studying recreational sports management. Lives at Smallwood. LS allegedly called his phone using JR's phone at 4:15 am. DR was allegedly in bed and did not answer. Participates in the first searches and is labeled as cooperative. Believed to be represented by attorney Ron Chapman.
13. Homeless man. Allegedly told law enforcement that he heard a scream at around 4:30 a.m. Reports concerning this man remain sketchy and unverified. Some say this character is completely fictitious.
14. Two girls. Allegedly two girls turned in LS's key and id.
15. Owner of a white truck. First police say there our a couple of vehicles in the area and they want to check out whether the owners know anything. Later photos of a white truck are released with the information that it was near the scene at 4:24 a.m. It apparently runs a stop sign and may have circled the block. Bloomington police then release a statement that the owner of the white truck has been identified and is not involved in the LS case. The identification of the driver of the truck remain private and are not released to public. No further mention is made of the other vehicles in the area.
16. Robert and Charlene Spierer. Grieving parents. Four months and still looking for their daughter. They just want closure, not a pound of flesh.
17. Law Enforcement. Police have refused to release the last known videos of LS for reasons completely unknown. At least one person has been very critical of the investigation. (See 7-9-11 update for link.) Even the Herald Times has quotes indicating that the landfills have yet to be searched. http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/07/16/news.qp-0661144.sto
18. Garbageman. Dumpsters in the area are usually picked up by 8:00 a.m. The garbage is typically brought to a station and then trucked to the landfill south of Terre Haute. Not unusual for the garbage to be buried in the landfill before noon.
19. L.S. Call her the wild card. With no physical evidence of a crime, could she have had temporary amnesia and be alive and living some where? Very doubtful, but we know of rare cases like Lula Hood found after forty years.
19. L.S. Call her the wild card. With no physical evidence of a crime, could she have had temporary amnesia and be alive and living some where? Very doubtful, but we know of rare cases like Lula Hood found after forty years.
Update 6-25-11: Search was not successful despite a good turn out of volunteers. No more formal press conferences unless the police discover something of significance.Update 6-29-11: State police helicopters flew over the Bloomington area confirming what has already been reported, the area is vast with lots of wooded areas and bodies of water. Official searches have been called off. The McNutt search headquarters will close today. Future searches will be conducted only pursuant to reliable tips. Presumably law enforcement has checked local land fills... Prayer service tomorrow night in Bloomington. Last scheduled press conference at BPD will be Friday. Lauren's parents will read a statement.
Update 6-24-11: Plans for a massive search on Saturday! Send in the drones...
Keep in mind we do not live in a police state where subjects are forced to submit to unfair interrogation. Indiana will not tolerate strong armed confessions like what apparently happened during the 1987 homicide investigation involving Peggy Hettrick. Timothy Masters, who was actually convicted of the crime, has recently been exonerated after serving ten years of a life sentence. Masterson was saved by DNA evidence. Shortly after the crime, the 15 year-old Masterson was subjected to vigorous police interrogation which ultimately resulted in his conviction.
Update 6-27-11: The days of wanting to clear one's name in the press have apparently become a thing of the past for some. Neither Jason Rosenbaum nor Jesse Wolff apparently have anything to say to Mr. or Mrs Spierer about their daughter. Their attorneys remain tight lipped as well. The Spierers just want closure. Nevertheless, there are growing rumors that Rosenbaum had a guest at his home that early morning besides Lauren. Police have not officially released the guest's name. The problem with rumors is that it can spread inaccurate information and spoil an investigation. If they turn out true, they can be darn right embarrassing for law enforcement if they let such an individual slip away without so much as an interview. So until either the police or the person's of interest come forward with facts, there is not much to do but ignore the rumors and wait until Lauren is discovered.
Update 6-28-11: Attorney James Voyles is truly a master who knows that silence is not always golden. Credit has to be given to Rosenbaum's attorney for not remaining silent. Monday afternoon, Voyles told the press that Rosenbaum has cooperated fully. He claims that his client gave "a full statement" to authorities and also said that the results of a polygraph have been shared with the police. (Presumably Voyles had a private polygraph given to Rosenbaum.) Voyles statements spawn additional questions. Does this open the door for the police to provide a response to the press? May they now ask this cooperative witness additional questions? And last but not least, "Who was your house guest that early morning"? Hadar Tamir claims that Rosenbaum had a friend from his hometown staying with him that early morning. One wonders if this individual offered police the opportunity to interview him and search his vehicle?
Update July 1, 2011: Thursdays prayer service was filled with support and encouragement for Robert and Charlene Spierer. A minister prayed that whoever knows what happened to Lauren steps out of "the shadows of darkness."
The Spierers will read a statement of thanks and a promise that they will not rest until Lauren is found.
Update 7-2-11: Perhaps we were the first to point out the disparate treatment of Morgan Johnson's case in our 6-10-11 update. Now, Morgan's mom is doing something about it. Ann Smith filed a civil rights complaint against the Plainfield Police Department. She wants them taken off the case immediately and wants the state police to take over the investigation and that the case get the same attention as the Lauren Spierer case. "Based on other current and recent investigations on other missing persons in Indiana, there is a disparity in the action taken for them and not the same actions taken for Morgan," said Smith. Ironically, at least one newspaper, the Indianapolis Star, appears to be very critical of the Bloomington police for not doing more in the 4 weeks since Lauren's disappearance.
Update 7-4-11: Yesterday evening around 7:00 p.m. some one called in a sighting of a body in Fall Creek (Marion County.) The badly decomposed female body has yet to be identified. While it is possible that this might be related to the Spierer case, it is more likely to be a missing Indianapolis woman.
Update 7-5-11: The official word is that an autopsy of the body is scheduled for Tuesday. Police hope the forensic examination leads to the woman's identity. A press conference has been scheduled for after the autopsy. Unofficially, L.P. has been told that the hair on the decomposed body will not rule out Lauren. The teeth, however, do not appear to be Lauren's. Thus, the search is likely to continue. Noon Update: The tip to L.P. was correct. The coronor confirmed that the body found in Fall Creek was NOT Lauren Spierer. The coronor believes the very badly decomposed body is that of an African American woman.Update 7-7-11: The public's thirst for knowledge has generated wild speculation and rumor. It is extremely unlikely that Lauren Spierer ran off to Israel or anywhere else without her shoes and cell phone. (Heck now days young adults don't typically leave the house without the ability to text. See Legal Pub article on sexting. LINK.) Similarly, it is unlikely that professionals were "called in" to dispose of a body. More likely the remains will turn up someday in a field or body of water. If that does not happen, then the remains may have made it to a land fill. Law enforcement continues to investigate and follow up leads. When they are ready to come forward, they certainly will do so.
Update 7-8-11: Recent news may encourage the Spierer family not to give up hope. Lula Cora Hood, disappeared in 1970 after a family fight. Forty years later, this missing Illinois woman has now been discovered alive and well and living in Florida. Forty years later, police in Galesburg, Illinois say they've found her in Florida.
Update 7-9-11: One reader suggested that the Bloomington Police Department should check their own ranks for Persons of Interest. While Legal Pub does not share this opinion, it is linking a site that apparently thinks such a hypothesis is worth exploring. LINK. In the meantime, Saturday is an opportunity for a renewed search for Lauren. Past searchers are gathering at the track in an event called "Laps for Lauren." The Find Lauren site has details for those interested in participating in the event. Twitter Find Lauren posted: "Don't be sorry, just start being honest. It's not going to go away. The situation or the guilt. No one will know you called. 800-CRIMETV."
Update 7-11-11: The rest of the world goes on with its lives as illustrated by Seven Eleven giving out free Slurpees in honor of today's date. For the Speirers, the struggle is not over and they are not alone. "We will continue to be with the family every step of the way,” said Rabbi Sue Silberberg, director of IU’s Helene G. Simon Hillel Center. “We are determined and will not stop until we find Lauren.” Similarly, IU is continuing to provide some funding to defray the cost of future recovery efforts.
Update 7-12-11: An early preview of tomorrows post. If this were a play, the cast might include a list of interesting people as potential characters. Please note these are not "suspects" and they are not even necessarily "persons of interest"; however, as one poster pointed out, they are all interesting people.
1. Mike Beth.Beth told The Journal News on 6-10-11 that he did give a DNA sample, but that he was told by his lawyer not to discuss the case with reporters. “I just hope that they find her,” he said. “She was our friend.” http://www.lohud.com/article/20110610/NEWS02/106100365/Police-obtain-DNA-from-Lauren-Spierer-s-companion-his-roommate ~by Shawn Cohen and Jonathan Bandler. Apparently cooperative. Note attorney Chapman says that the lawyers for MB, CR and JR have all discussed the matter and Chapman claims none of these three are responsible for the LS disappearance. LINK.
2. Corey Rossman. He is one of the few legal drinkers as he is 21. In the Kelley School of Business studying real estate finance. Apparently met L.S. at the Indy 500. Some speculate that CR might have been a johnny come lately in LS's romantic life with the two of them sharing some mutual attraction. CR joined LS at Rossman's early in the evening. CR and L.S. then went to Killroy's and then later to Smallwood where CR is apparently on a "no trespass" list. At Smallwood CR was allegedly punched by Z.O. CR and L.S. then apparently returned to CR's apartment at 5 North Townhomes where M.B. puts CR to bed. CR has little or no memory after the alleged punch according to his attorney (Salzmann) CR has apparently been cooperative.
3. Jesse Wolff. Lauren's long time boyfriend from New York. JW lived at 9th and Fess, about six blocks away from JR's. He was reportedly at home watching basketball that evening and went to bed at 2:30 a.m. Later that morning he drove a roommate to 8:00 a.m. class and tracked down Lauren's phone at Killroys. He also got a key from Tamir Hadar and confirmed L.S. was not in her room. He also called L.S. parents. He is believed to be represented by attorney Joe Lozano. Initially cooperative. (On 7-22-11, JW's facebook claims he has spoken to police and passed a polograph.)
4. Jay Rosenbaum. From West Bloomfield, MI. Lives at 5 North Townhomes two doors down from CR and MB. Apparently his apartment was a gathering place sometime after midnight. Early in the evening he hosted guest including LS, DR and CR. He may have also had a house guest who for purposes of discussion only, we will give the frictional name of D.B. JR's story is apparently that CR and LS left for the bars. LS apparently came back around 3:00 a.m. She allegedly called DR on his phone at 4:15. At 4:30 he says he saw her leave his apartment, and round the corner at 11th and college. Initially cooperative. Represented by James Voyles who told the public that his client passed a polygraph, presumably a privately administered one.
5. House guest of JR. HT suggested that JR had a house guest that early morning. LINK. We have given this "house guest" the fictional identification of D.B. He might be a hometown guest visiting JR who could fill in some of the gaps missing from "play" as it currently might be written. Police have not released the name of the house guest or what if anything he knows about the early morning in question. So, what if anything does the mysterious house guest know about that morning?
Update 7-11-11: The rest of the world goes on with its lives as illustrated by Seven Eleven giving out free Slurpees in honor of today's date. For the Speirers, the struggle is not over and they are not alone. "We will continue to be with the family every step of the way,” said Rabbi Sue Silberberg, director of IU’s Helene G. Simon Hillel Center. “We are determined and will not stop until we find Lauren.” Similarly, IU is continuing to provide some funding to defray the cost of future recovery efforts.
Update 7-12-11: An early preview of tomorrows post. If this were a play, the cast might include a list of interesting people as potential characters. Please note these are not "suspects" and they are not even necessarily "persons of interest"; however, as one poster pointed out, they are all interesting people.
1. Mike Beth.Beth told The Journal News on 6-10-11 that he did give a DNA sample, but that he was told by his lawyer not to discuss the case with reporters. “I just hope that they find her,” he said. “She was our friend.” http://www.lohud.com/article/20110610/NEWS02/106100365/Police-obtain-DNA-from-Lauren-Spierer-s-companion-his-roommate ~by Shawn Cohen and Jonathan Bandler. Apparently cooperative. Note attorney Chapman says that the lawyers for MB, CR and JR have all discussed the matter and Chapman claims none of these three are responsible for the LS disappearance. LINK.
2. Corey Rossman. He is one of the few legal drinkers as he is 21. In the Kelley School of Business studying real estate finance. Apparently met L.S. at the Indy 500. Some speculate that CR might have been a johnny come lately in LS's romantic life with the two of them sharing some mutual attraction. CR joined LS at Rossman's early in the evening. CR and L.S. then went to Killroy's and then later to Smallwood where CR is apparently on a "no trespass" list. At Smallwood CR was allegedly punched by Z.O. CR and L.S. then apparently returned to CR's apartment at 5 North Townhomes where M.B. puts CR to bed. CR has little or no memory after the alleged punch according to his attorney (Salzmann) CR has apparently been cooperative.
3. Jesse Wolff. Lauren's long time boyfriend from New York. JW lived at 9th and Fess, about six blocks away from JR's. He was reportedly at home watching basketball that evening and went to bed at 2:30 a.m. Later that morning he drove a roommate to 8:00 a.m. class and tracked down Lauren's phone at Killroys. He also got a key from Tamir Hadar and confirmed L.S. was not in her room. He also called L.S. parents. He is believed to be represented by attorney Joe Lozano. Initially cooperative. (On 7-22-11, JW's facebook claims he has spoken to police and passed a polograph.)
4. Jay Rosenbaum. From West Bloomfield, MI. Lives at 5 North Townhomes two doors down from CR and MB. Apparently his apartment was a gathering place sometime after midnight. Early in the evening he hosted guest including LS, DR and CR. He may have also had a house guest who for purposes of discussion only, we will give the frictional name of D.B. JR's story is apparently that CR and LS left for the bars. LS apparently came back around 3:00 a.m. She allegedly called DR on his phone at 4:15. At 4:30 he says he saw her leave his apartment, and round the corner at 11th and college. Initially cooperative. Represented by James Voyles who told the public that his client passed a polygraph, presumably a privately administered one.
5. House guest of JR. HT suggested that JR had a house guest that early morning. LINK. We have given this "house guest" the fictional identification of D.B. He might be a hometown guest visiting JR who could fill in some of the gaps missing from "play" as it currently might be written. Police have not released the name of the house guest or what if anything he knows about the early morning in question. So, what if anything does the mysterious house guest know about that morning?
6. Z.O. The name assigned to a character who allegedly punched CR at Smallwood a little after 2:30 a.m. LS was apparently with CR at the time. The reason for the dispute is unknown although early media accounts would suggest that perhaps CR was being aggressive toward L.S. however, keep in mind LS voluntarily left with CR after the alleged altercation. (Note video of the alleged altercation have not been released to the public so the identity of the alleged puncher is not confirmed.)
20. Indiana University. IU hates the negative press. A warning has been issued to incoming freshman.
Keep in mind NONE of the above are suspects nor are they even necessarily "person's of interest." All are, however, interesting people some of whom may be able to help solve the mystery of "what happened to Lauren."Update 7-22-11: Assume this report of Lauren stumbling around Smallwood with CR is correct. LINK. Why is that such a surprise? Does someone who is not under the influence of some intoxicating substance leave shoes, cell phone and perhaps a coat elsewhere? Again assuming this is true, LS lacked capacity to knowingly consent to anything. (An intoxicated person lacks capacity to consume more alcohol, take drugs, or have sex.) Re-read Legal Pub 7-15-11 update. Now, do you really still wonder why some folks might not be too eager to volunteer information leading to her discovery? Find the body and the rest will follow...
Update 7-18-11: Harley Ride for Lauren is scheduled for 7-30-11. Here is our issue Nancy Grace: For weeks Legal Pub has suggested a search of the landfill. Officer Parker back on 6-10-11 said dumpsters and landfills were searched.
http://www.thedailygreenburgh.com/neighbors/spierer-case-appear-americas-most-wantedNow BPD is aparently admitting that land fills were never searched. http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/07/16/news.qp-0661144.stoThe Sycamore Ridge Landfill is the final destination for all Indiana University and Bloomingonton Indiana trash. Garbage is mixed with garbage from other destinations; however, the location of each day's dump can be located through GPS. Talk about a story on credibility. Why are you scared to get your hands dirty, CNN? (Finally 8-15-11 Nancy Graces Blog starts to get interested...)Update 7-20-11: Many responses have been offered concerning the land fill controversy. One supporter of the BPD pointed out that on 6-18 a massive search was conducted in Martinsville based on a tip. LINK. Furthermore, if there is any truth to the growing rumor that the 4:15 a.m. call may not have originated in Bloomington, then there may be rhyme to their reasoning. Police are not corroborating any rumor, but if the origin of the call was traced to a place other than Bloomington, then the failure to immediately search the Pimento landfill may be justified. Keep in mind that at this point it is only unsubstantiated rumor. Visit this Facebook to help keep attention on Lauren: LINK.
Update 7-21-11: Most missing people don't generate a great deal of media coverage. LINK. So what? This one did. So what is the media going to do to help find Lauren? One word of advice, try to be a leader and not a follower! Go interview the cell phone provider. Get a quote for exactly how much the search of the landfill will cost. Do it today!
Mrs. Spierer speaks: An open letter from Mrs. Spierer may be found here: LINK.
Update 8-16-11: The roar of the huge backhoes couldn't be ignored. The landfill search began early this morning under the direction of the FBI and Bloomington Police Department. As of noon they were still digging and we have been informed that the search may last up to two weeks. No one is allowed to get too close as the fumes are apparently toxic.
Update 8-17-11: Trash search video: LINK. Police chief was on the scene today. (See comments.) Lauren's parents to leave and go back to New York for a "family function." Speculation is rising... Now may be the time for any POI to make a deal...
Update 8-22-11: Police have completed one week of trash scrutiny. The 12 hour shifts should end within the next 7 days. So far, no report of any evidence found.
Update July 13, 2011: SO WHERE IS NANCY GRACE? She crusaded so hard against the tot mom, Casey Anthony. The Anthony story is now a dead horse. Stop beating it and the jury to death. Your show has a chance to demonstrate real investigatory journalism. Find Lauren Spierer! Nancy, accept the challenge and see if the truth can be uncovered irrespective of the money. The Speirer family needs closure and persons of interest need to be cleared of scrutiny. You know you need credibility (and ratings) after the Anthony debacle. The challenge: Show the world that NANCY GRACE has superior investigatory reporting skills and help BPD find Lauren.
Update July 14, 2011: Still no hint of Nancy Grace getting involved. Feel free to contact her using this LINK. For those frustrated with the pace of the investigation, keep in mind the following:
~ You can only protect your liberties in this world by protecting the other man's freedom. You can only be free if I am free. ~Clarence Darrow.~ I have always found that mercy bears richer fruits than strict justice. ~Abraham Lincoln.
~ It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.~William Blackstone.(Bet some of you thought Jimmy Voyles said all these things first. LOL.)
Update July 15, 2011: It has been said that silence breeds contempt. In this case, silence breeds speculation. One of the theories bantered about is that someone gave LS a "date rape drug." Such a drug is any chemical that can assist in the execution of a sex crime, typically a sedative or hypnotic which tends to induce amnesia. (This could include serving her alcohol past the point of intoxication.) "Drink spiking"is when an intoxicating substance is added to a drink for amusement or malicious intent (robbery, battery, sexual assault etc). The concept is not new. For centuries, alcohol has incapacitated individuals and lowered inhibitions.
In-gestation of such substances can be voluntary or involuntary. The most common substances are alcohol, benodiazepines (flunitrazepam, midazolam, temazepam or rohupnol) and GHB (gamma-hydroxybutyric acid). Alcohol remains the most common substance used in large part because of its availability and acceptability. Furthermore, most victims willing consume the alcohol. However, even if an intoxicated victim agrees to sex, it can still be considered "rape" due to the lack of ability to consent. A limited example would be having sex with someone who has passed out. Respiratory depression, coma and even death are real possibilities when someone ingests a date rape drug, especially if mixed with alcohol. In the case of LS we have no real evidence other than she was at a bar drinking alcohol and her movements on video which apparently depict her conduct. Despite the limited evidence, it appears to be a safe assumption that she was intoxicated. But to what extent?
Update July 14, 2011: Still no hint of Nancy Grace getting involved. Feel free to contact her using this LINK. For those frustrated with the pace of the investigation, keep in mind the following:
~ You can only protect your liberties in this world by protecting the other man's freedom. You can only be free if I am free. ~Clarence Darrow.~ I have always found that mercy bears richer fruits than strict justice. ~Abraham Lincoln.
~ It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.~William Blackstone.(Bet some of you thought Jimmy Voyles said all these things first. LOL.)
Update July 15, 2011: It has been said that silence breeds contempt. In this case, silence breeds speculation. One of the theories bantered about is that someone gave LS a "date rape drug." Such a drug is any chemical that can assist in the execution of a sex crime, typically a sedative or hypnotic which tends to induce amnesia. (This could include serving her alcohol past the point of intoxication.) "Drink spiking"is when an intoxicating substance is added to a drink for amusement or malicious intent (robbery, battery, sexual assault etc). The concept is not new. For centuries, alcohol has incapacitated individuals and lowered inhibitions.
In-gestation of such substances can be voluntary or involuntary. The most common substances are alcohol, benodiazepines (flunitrazepam, midazolam, temazepam or rohupnol) and GHB (gamma-hydroxybutyric acid). Alcohol remains the most common substance used in large part because of its availability and acceptability. Furthermore, most victims willing consume the alcohol. However, even if an intoxicated victim agrees to sex, it can still be considered "rape" due to the lack of ability to consent. A limited example would be having sex with someone who has passed out. Respiratory depression, coma and even death are real possibilities when someone ingests a date rape drug, especially if mixed with alcohol. In the case of LS we have no real evidence other than she was at a bar drinking alcohol and her movements on video which apparently depict her conduct. Despite the limited evidence, it appears to be a safe assumption that she was intoxicated. But to what extent?
Update 7-18-11: Harley Ride for Lauren is scheduled for 7-30-11. Here is our issue Nancy Grace: For weeks Legal Pub has suggested a search of the landfill. Officer Parker back on 6-10-11 said dumpsters and landfills were searched.
http://www.thedailygreenburgh.com/neighbors/spierer-case-appear-americas-most-wantedNow BPD is aparently admitting that land fills were never searched. http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/07/16/news.qp-0661144.stoThe Sycamore Ridge Landfill is the final destination for all Indiana University and Bloomingonton Indiana trash. Garbage is mixed with garbage from other destinations; however, the location of each day's dump can be located through GPS. Talk about a story on credibility. Why are you scared to get your hands dirty, CNN? (Finally 8-15-11 Nancy Graces Blog starts to get interested...)Update 7-20-11: Many responses have been offered concerning the land fill controversy. One supporter of the BPD pointed out that on 6-18 a massive search was conducted in Martinsville based on a tip. LINK. Furthermore, if there is any truth to the growing rumor that the 4:15 a.m. call may not have originated in Bloomington, then there may be rhyme to their reasoning. Police are not corroborating any rumor, but if the origin of the call was traced to a place other than Bloomington, then the failure to immediately search the Pimento landfill may be justified. Keep in mind that at this point it is only unsubstantiated rumor. Visit this Facebook to help keep attention on Lauren: LINK.
Update 7-21-11: Most missing people don't generate a great deal of media coverage. LINK. So what? This one did. So what is the media going to do to help find Lauren? One word of advice, try to be a leader and not a follower! Go interview the cell phone provider. Get a quote for exactly how much the search of the landfill will cost. Do it today!
Mrs. Spierer speaks: An open letter from Mrs. Spierer may be found here: LINK.
Jessie Wolff speaks: A reporter from Journal News has apparently decided to step out of the shadows of the followers and has tried to contact JW. Wolff finally responded today via Facebook, urging "Leave me alone please." Wolff added, "I spoke with the detectives Tuesday and have taken a polygraph. All my cards are out on the table ..." According to this article, when asked whether police administered the polygraph, and for the results, Wolff replied, "what the (expletive) do you think the results were? if i failed a polygraph everyone in the world would know ...." LINK.
Update 7-26-11: A break in the case or another distraction? Six blocks away from where Lauren Spierer disappeared, Meredith Ephlin, an IU student, reports that a man attempted to strangle her. The 34 year old woman was apparently walking to a convenience store near 17th and Woodburn when she was attacked. At the current time, law enforcement is downplaying any possible relationship to the Spierer disappearance. LINK.
Update 8-3-11: A search warrant has been executed to search the Republic Sycamore Ridge Landfill on East Cottom in Pimento (near Terre Haute, IN.) A section of the landfill has been roped off as the area where trash was dumped from Bloomington. The excavation and search of the site will be under the direct supervision of the FBI. LINK.
Update 8-12-11: So far, nothing more than persistant rumors. There are unconfirmed rumors that a security guard was in the vicinity of 11th and College around 4:30 a.m. If true, what the security guard saw or what he did not see, may be very helpful in confirming or refuting the story of JR. Another rumor that just won't die is that some people are hiding the identity of a person with major drug connections. Fact is, for now they are just unconfirmed rumors. Come fall, when the vegetation dies and crops are harvested, there will be fewer locations for the "rumors" to hide.
Update 7-26-11: A break in the case or another distraction? Six blocks away from where Lauren Spierer disappeared, Meredith Ephlin, an IU student, reports that a man attempted to strangle her. The 34 year old woman was apparently walking to a convenience store near 17th and Woodburn when she was attacked. At the current time, law enforcement is downplaying any possible relationship to the Spierer disappearance. LINK.
Update 8-3-11: A search warrant has been executed to search the Republic Sycamore Ridge Landfill on East Cottom in Pimento (near Terre Haute, IN.) A section of the landfill has been roped off as the area where trash was dumped from Bloomington. The excavation and search of the site will be under the direct supervision of the FBI. LINK.
Update 8-12-11: So far, nothing more than persistant rumors. There are unconfirmed rumors that a security guard was in the vicinity of 11th and College around 4:30 a.m. If true, what the security guard saw or what he did not see, may be very helpful in confirming or refuting the story of JR. Another rumor that just won't die is that some people are hiding the identity of a person with major drug connections. Fact is, for now they are just unconfirmed rumors. Come fall, when the vegetation dies and crops are harvested, there will be fewer locations for the "rumors" to hide.
Update 8-16-11: The roar of the huge backhoes couldn't be ignored. The landfill search began early this morning under the direction of the FBI and Bloomington Police Department. As of noon they were still digging and we have been informed that the search may last up to two weeks. No one is allowed to get too close as the fumes are apparently toxic.
Update 8-17-11: Trash search video: LINK. Police chief was on the scene today. (See comments.) Lauren's parents to leave and go back to New York for a "family function." Speculation is rising... Now may be the time for any POI to make a deal...
Update 8-22-11: Police have completed one week of trash scrutiny. The 12 hour shifts should end within the next 7 days. So far, no report of any evidence found.
Update 8-24-11: Video criticism of CR and other so called "friends" of Lauren Spierer. LINK
Update 8-27-11: The almighty roar of the equipment came to an end on Friday. The search is now officially over."The fact that no evidence related to this case was discovered is unfortunate, but we are confident that the proper area at the landfill was identified and thoroughly checked by the officers working there," said Chief Michael Diekhoff. Some two dozen police, FBI agents and an expert from the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children searched the 8,400-square-foot area of the landfill.
Update 8-27-11: The almighty roar of the equipment came to an end on Friday. The search is now officially over."The fact that no evidence related to this case was discovered is unfortunate, but we are confident that the proper area at the landfill was identified and thoroughly checked by the officers working there," said Chief Michael Diekhoff. Some two dozen police, FBI agents and an expert from the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children searched the 8,400-square-foot area of the landfill.
Update 8-29-11: School started at IU. Another search on Sunday was unsuccessful. Quotes of interest: "It was the worst news I could have gotten. It's just, there are no words to describe it, hearing that your best friend is missing...We're still finding her, and I'm still as determined as I was the minute I heard it that we're going to find her. I'm never going to give up," said IU student Blair Wallach.
Update 8-30-11: Jay Rosenbaum claims that he has talked to Lauren's parents privately. Video LINK. I wonder if Lauren's mom or dad would verify such a conversation?
Lauren Spierer's Mom tells FOX59 "I have not spoken with Jay Rosenbaum. I was surprised to hear his comment. Jay says he speaks to parents." LINK.
Update 9-5-11: Mrs. Spierer has sent an open letter to her daughter's abductor:
"If you think for a minute, her father and I are going to disappear, think again. We are just as determined today as we were day one," Charlene Spierer writes. "Do you think this is a game? This is no game. We are in this for the long haul ... we will NEVER give up."
Latest statments of Hadar Tamir:"When we had to move out and saw her room so empty, we just sat on the floor crying... It was completely surreal... We went home for the summer and came back, and nothing has changed, really." LINK
September 14, 2011: The body found in a wooded area of Jennings County in southern Indiana is not Lauren Spierer. Capt. Joe Qualters confirmed that the body found does not match Lauren's description.
September 19, 2011: Rob and Charlene Spierer, remain in Bloomington to prepare for a Sept. 22 concert and walk to bring attention to search and investigation efforts.
September 28, 2011: Can you say "You don't pull the mask off the old Long Ranger and you don't mess around with slim? Dietl & Associates, private investigators, are apparently not licensed in the state of Indiana according to the state Attorney General's Office. A firm representative appearance on a Fox morning show where he made fun of Bloomington Police Chief Michael Diekhoff. Now expect the private detectives to be barred from participating further in the Lauren Spierer case.
October 10, 2011: Legal Pub had a presence today in Bloomington. This is what we have learned about the body found in Bloomington, Illinois: Badly decomposed white female. NOT LOCAL. Coroner awaiting dental and DNA confirmation of identiy. Based on missing person's report she has an idea who it may be. (She is not giving any further information until DNA and dental records confirm her hunch.) While the body was found far from Bloomington, Indiana, anything is possible...
October 12, 2011: Still no official word on the identity of the remains found. Names like Kathy Christensen from North Chicago, who has been missing since April, Bonnie Woodward who has been missing since June, 2010, Stacy Peterson who has been missing forever and Lauren Spierer who has been missing since June have been tossed around. In the meantime there are reports out of Bloomington, Indiana that it does not appear to be Lauren. However, we will wait for the official DNA results.
October 13, 2011: McLean County Coroner Beth Kimmerling said that Jean L. Kelly of Minier was identified through dental records. Kelly had been missing since early September. Cause of death and toxicology are pending.October 24, 2011: Mrs. Spierer posted on a blog that she was hurt by an anonymous letter sent to her complaining that her search posters are "littering Bloomington."
November 3, 2011: Jay Rosenbaum, in the presence of own of his attorneys, has met with Mr. and Mrs. Spierer and their attorney on September 19, 2011. Rosenbaum also met with the Spierer family's investigator, Bo Dietl, on Sept. 21. Jay subsequently reported to the Journal News: "Yes, I have cooperated since day one, and I will continue to cooperate... And I had nothing to do with the disappearance of Lauren. Obviously, there's nothing more that I want than for Lauren to be found and safe, and for this all to be over." Attorney Lukemeyer said she "... felt compelled to defend her client now because he continues to face heavy scrutiny."
January 7, 2012: Bill Warner's blog questions whether the disappearance of six petite females, Crystal Hall, Paige Johnson, Holly Bobo, Lauren Spierer, Katelyn Markham and Karen Swift are all related... LINK.
January 20, 2012: Lauren's parents have enlisted the help of New York detectives. The Spierer's apparently feel comfortable eliminating some person's of interest. Those cooperating apparently include J.W., J.R., and M.B. Others may also be cooperating. LINK.
February 27, 2012: Lauren's family has increased the amount of reward money offered for information leading to her discovery $100,000 to $250,000. Family blog: blog site.
May 1, 2012: As the anniversary date of Lauren Spierer's disappearance approaches, the "deafening silence" makes it look more and more like a random abduction. After all, what college kids could keep their mouths shut this long if they were actually involved? One would suspect, not many. The tip lines are still open and the reward money is still available.
May 15, 2012: As "find Lauren" posters are being made for the upcoming anniversary of Lauren's disappearance, it sometimes appears that police are grasping at straws. Police are reportedly looking at William Clyde Gibson, a man who is suspected in the deaths of three women more than 100 miles away from the Bloomington according to the Journal News. (William Clyde Gibson is charged with the 2002 murder of 45-year-old Karen Hodella and the murder of 75-year-old Christine Whitis. He is also suspected of murder with regards to another woman found buried in his backyard.) At this time; however, there are no specific leads that indicate Gibson may have been involved in Lauren's disappearance.
May 29, 2012: Lauren Spierer's disappearance ha no connection to the disappearance of Mickey Shunick, the University of Louisina student that disappeared May 19, 2012. Capt. Joe Qualters told the press: “Any reports of a ‘connection’ have been manufactured by the media and was never put forth by us... I simply indicated to a media person that we’d made an ‘inquiry’— a seemingly appropriate thing to do — and that was turned into us contacting them because of ‘similarities’ which is inaccurate.. Nothing of significance to the Spierer investigation came from the discussion held with police investigators in Louisiana.”
August 13, 2012: A fisherman found a skull in Marion County. Speculation was that it could be Lauren. It was not her. It wasn't covered here because it was unwarranted speculation. If something credible happens, we will cover it.
August 20, 2012: Still nothing. The armed man who claimed he met Lauren Spierer at a shooting range was not arrested. He had been surveilling Killroys. No crime was committed. His name was not released. The 56-year-old man had two guns on him and a shotgun in the trunk. The man wasn’t believed to be involved in Lauren's disappearance.
December 10, 2012: As the holidays approach, the frustration of family increases with the current stalemate known as "The Lauren Spierer Investigation." Lauren's parents do not believe their daughter’s disappearance was a “random abduction.” They have publicly criticized Lauren's male friends who were the last to see her before she vanished. “We have these boys that were there that night that clammed up, shut down, lawyered up,” Robert Spierer, said on “Katie.” Lauren Spierer's parents continue to offer a $250,000 reward.
February 11, 2013: Despite months of searching, still no sign of Lauren Spierer. There have been no arrests and no suspects named. CBS New York, claims that police have received more than 2,400 tips in the case. Nevertheless, no end is in sight. Perhaps warm weather will lead to a well deserved resolution to this tragedy.
February 3, 2016: Has the trail become warm or is it still cold? It depends who you consult. The Bloomington Herald-Times documented a recent search warrant search on Doug Wager's property. His son Justin Wagers was thought to be the target of that search. Doug Wagers, told the newspaper that police spent four to six hours searching the family property in Trafalgar as well as the family residence. Doug Wagers said he told investigators to search, and search hard, because his son, Justin, is innocent.
“The system got a hold of him and the only thing he did wrong was indecent exposure," Doug Wagers explained. Mean while, Justin Wagers, who has a history of public indecency arrests, is currently being held in the Johnson County Jail on charges of public indecency and performing sexual conduct in the presence of a minor. This does not, of course, mean that he had anything to do with Lauren Spierer's disappearance. As always, Wagers is to be presumed innocent unless otherwise convicted in a court of law.
June 9, 2016: Brad Garrett and some private consultants working with Spierer's family are still trying to figure out what
happened to Lauren who disappeared from Bloomington, Indiana in 2011.March 15, 2019: Now approaching the eight year mark, the trail is still cold. Many theories, some inconsistent statements, but mostly rank speculation. DNA analysis would probably identify the killer, but without a body, there is little analysis to be done. Lauren's parents posted on FaceBook:
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
-Edmund Burke-
Readers are reminded if you have information, please contact:
Bloomington Police Department 812.339.4477
Or email: helpfindlauren@gmail.com
Posts
717 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 600 of 717 Newer› Newest»No, I think it's not at all unusual for college-age females to walk home from work alone, walk home from a nearby parking lot, etc. @ odd hours.
But those times don't rule out that the 3:38am sighting by the barmaid is still accurate.
I've shared my possible theory before. Here it is again. I'd love to hear comments from those following this case.
Once LS arrives back @ JR’s townhome around 3am, JR has "some sort of contact" with the unable-to-truly-consent LS. Maybe JR’s mystery hometown house-guest does also. Then the mystery house-guest sets out to walk the out-of-it LS home @ 3:35am – she’s too out-of-it to notice she doesnt have her apartment keys.
When LS absolutely collapsed/passed out/fell unconscious on the walk back to Smallwood, the out-of-towner didnt know how to get back to her place. i.e. LS was setting the course back to Smallwood until she passed out. @ 3:38am: He threw her over his shoulder and did the only thing he could do, returned to JR’s place with her.
It’s now 4am, JR and the guest can’t revive her. They look around and see her apartment keys aren’t anywhere to be found. JR calls Rohn hoping to gain access to Smallwood, to dump LS into her own bed, or at least into her own hallway, but Rohn doesnt answer. Lucky for JR because the video cameras would’ve nabbed him entering Smallwood w/ the unconscious LS.
So now JR and his guest have a decision to make….call 911? Knowing their DNA will be found if she’s examined (and JR, for one, will be shunned within his peer group and their parents, perhaps leading to a lifetime of shame and ensuing failure as the story follows him wherever he goes), they devise some sort of plan. Maybe the houseguest just drove her out of town @ 4:30am in his vehicle, leaving JR to tell authorities “she left my place @ 4:30am”. The guest takes all drugs, drug paraphernalia etc with him.
Just an idea, since we still don't have an ID on this mystery houseguest.
5 male college students' hiring of attorneys just raises a bunch of suspicion, which leads to my speculation.
Well JR’s house guest had a vehicle, now you can begin to consider that the information that JR did not have access to a vehicle was produced by JR’s clan. Actual disinformation…a lie.
So why the lie?
Maybe now it is safe to assume that this houseguest (who was sleeping on the couch at 3:00 AM) may have offered a whacked-out, shoeless Lauren, a ride home in the vehicle that was not there according to the disinformation masters.
What does LE really know about the hypothetical guest with no vehicle who suddenly appears on the radar…from the kids who know and have their own form of justice?
What about his past…anything that mummy and daddy covered up?
Update 7-8-11: Recent news may encourage the Spierer family not to give up hope. Lula Cora Hood, disappeared in 1970 after a family fight. Forty years later, she has now been discovered alive and well and living in Florida.
Bbtown:
Your theory is possible if the house guest did not have a car. I personally think she got into a car in the gravel alley/ parking lot.
I agree with VG. Information needs to be garnered from the house guest of JR and we might be able to fill in the rest of the blanks.
personally, I think the witness who says she saw LS at 3:38 is either 40 minutes off on her time or saw some one else.
sometimes late night bars set their clocks ahead fast so that they don't run into problems of selling etc after closing call.
Btown:
I think the theory is plausible but I personally believe that something either happened at the scene where she lost her keys or the lost items were moved after the fact.
http://theforceofreason.wordpress.com/2011/07/07/my-lauren-spierer-abduction-theory/
suggests that the list of persons of interest shoulc include the Bloomington P.D.
Seems reasonable as we cricize other persons of interest for not speaking up and telling us what they know....
one should have a look at some of the other postings on forceofreason.wordpress.cm
i think the person might be ill
Some one may be feeling either frustrated, disappointed, angry or guilty. Who knows?
If D.P was roast guest, why is it not reporrted???
D.B you mean? Reason is likely because it has not been officially confirmed.
VG and Stuky: Please get me straight on this. A guy named Aj A. supposedly found LS SINGULAR key some place near ZP, Arjun B and B.B.'s apartment at 3:00 a.m.?
Is that accurate?
And was her purse originally left with the shoes at the bar and then later moved?
As for that wordpage website that was linked…I see no reason that BPD would be involved with her abduction. No motive whatsoever! The only reason I could see a cover-up or a mislead investigation would be that the drugs that caused Lauren to OD can be traced to a dealer who is connected with the local political scene, or someone in BPD. And if you don’t think such things happen than I have a bridge to sell you.
Drew Peterson of the Lacy Peterson case was an undercover drug enforcement officer there in Bolingbrook and accused of selling drugs he stole from his busts. He was never charged but demoted because officially they knew there was something to it since he was living way beyond the means of his LE salary.
A grade school friend of mine joined the military and became an MP, he went on to be a police officer for a Chicago suburb where he busted the suburbs Mayor’s son for selling cocaine. There was intense political pressure for him to drop the charges but he refused. Before the case ever went to court he was fired from the police force on some trumped up charges that damaged his career. I only found out about his situation years later when working with him as a bouncer at a local bar, one of the few jobs he could find after the charges against him.
I told him; “Are you stupid, everyone on the street knows if they don’t want to get busted than one buys from the connected dealers…everyone else in fair game…remember Serpico!”
Now I’m not saying that BPD is involved in anyway, but if they were somehow, I would think it is because of the drug scene there. And I’ll take the word on the street (rumors) as LE usually does, over anything the press has to say in this case as that is usually where the truth lies. Which is why I pay particular attention to what the kids related to this case are posting on the Internet. I also believe that much intentional disinformation is being introduced here as well…Why?
And If you think the “War on Drugs” is about stopping drug use and supply in this country, than you are as naive and stupid as my friend who busted the local Mayors son. There are more drugs in more abundant supplies now than before the war on drugs, this war is about control of the supply and you are paying for it with tax dollars. And our prisons are filled with independents who try to grab a small piece of the pie.
Manuel Noriega was one of the biggest drug suppliers and money launderer in Central America and once he fell out of favor with those that used him…well we know what happened next. And it was not because of this reason that they went after him or we would have heard that reason…instead he was portrayed as a brutal dictator as they did not want to go down the other road as connections could be made from further investigations.
I'm sure he was brutal as most in his line of work are, so it was an easy portrayal to make.
(VG and Stuky: Please get me straight on this. A guy named Aj A. supposedly found LS SINGULAR key some place near ZP, Arjun B and B.B.'s apartment at 3:00 a.m.?)
IDK…I read that MB had seen the key(s) there later that morning and walked right by them and possibly Aj A picked them/it up later and placed it on the railing. I’m not sure where the purse was found
No, it was all one thing, a wristlet that carried her key, key card, and ID
Seen by AA, AA friend that night around 3 Am, then the following morning 2 females (one interviewed in MSM), one of whom who turned it in to LE
Update 7-11-11: The rest of the world goes on with its lives as illustrated by Seven Eleven giving out free Slurpees in honor of today's date. For the Speirers, the struggle is not over and they are not alone. "We will continue to be with the family every step of the way,” said Rabbi Sue Silberberg, director of IU’s Helene G. Simon Hillel Center. “We are determined and will not stop until we find Lauren.” Similarly, IU is continuing to provide some funding to defray the cost of future recovery efforts.
Did Seven 11 pay for that ad?
With no body and no one talking, I am bunkering down for a long haul.
PLEASE keep updating your site. Your comments and info are very important, thank you.
Tomorrow's Legal Pub Today:
Update 7-12-11: If this were a play, the cast might include a list of interesting people as potential characters. Please note these are not "suspects" and they are not even necessarily "persons of interest"; however, as one poster pointed out, they are all interesting people.
1. M.B. Roommate of CR. Up late, allegedly sober working on a paper. Beth told The Journal News on 6-10-11 that he did give a DNA sample, but that he was told by his lawyer not to discuss the case with reporters. “I just hope that they find her,” he said. “She was our friend.” http://www.lohud.com/article/20110610/NEWS02/106100365/Police-obtain-DNA-from-Lauren-Spierer-s-companion-his-roommate ~by Shawn Cohen and Jonathan Bandler. Apparently cooperative.
2. C.R. Apparently met L.S. at the Indy 500. Joined her at CR's early in the evening. He and L.S. then went ot Killroy' and then later to Smallwood. At Smallwood he was allegedly punched by Z.O. He and L.S. then apparently returned to CR's apartment at 5 North Townhomes where M.B. put him to bed. He has little or no memory after the alleged punch. He is represented by Attorney Salzmann and has apparently been cooperative.
3. J.W. L.S. boyfriend from New York. He was reportedly at home watching basketball that evening and went to bed at 2:30 a.m. Later that morning he drove a roommate to 8:00 a.m. class and tracked down LS's phone at Killroys. He also got a key from T.H. and confirmed L.S. was not in her room. He also called L.S. parents. He is represented by an attorney. Initially cooperative.
4. JR. Apparently his apartment was a gathering place sometime after midnight. Early in the evening he hosted guest including LS, DR and CR. He may have also had a house guest who for purposes of discussion only, we will give the frictional name of D.B. JR's story is apparently that CR and LS left for the bars. LS apparently came back around 3:00 a.m. She allegedly called DR on his phone at 4:15. At 4:30 he says he saw her leave his apartment, and round the corner at 11th and college. Initially cooperative. Represented by Voyles who told the public that his client passed a polygraph, presumably a privately administered one.
5. House guest of JR. We have given this person the fictional identification of D.B. He might be a hometown guest visiting JR who could fill in some of the gaps missing from "play" as it currently might be written. Police have not released the name of the house guest or what if anything he knows about the early morning in question. So, what if anything does the mysterious house guest know about that morning?
6. Z.O. A character who allegedly punched CR at Smallwood a little after 2:30 a.m. LS was apparently with CR at the time. The reason for the dispute is unknown although early media accounts would suggest that perhaps CR was being aggressive toward L.S. however, keep in mind LS voluntarily left with CR after the alleged altercation. (Note video of the alleged altercation have not been released to the public.)
7. Mystery man in alley. Police have said LS last appears on video around 2:51 p.m. in the presence of a known person. This could be CR or someone entirely different.
8. Mystery man described by bar manager at 3:38 a.m. This could be number 7 with an error in time or it could be someone completely different. Bar manager says someone looking like L.S. is drunk and thrown over the shoulder of the dark skinned, polo clad rather short individual.
9. A.B. and B.B. This cast of characters would be roommates of ZO. They apparently live at 10th and college. What exactly were they doing that early morning? Their involvement or lack of involvement has not been verified nor publicly released.
10. A.A. Described off the record as an all around good guy. He apparently saw LS's key around 3:00 a.m.
continued....
11. Hadar Tamir . LS roommate. One of only a few that have openly shared thoughts with the press. Says Wolff is a great boyfriend who would never hurt LS. Labelled as a very cooperative witness.
12. D.R. Lives at Smallwood. LS allegedly called his phone using JR's phone at 4:15 am. DR was allegedly in bed and did not answer. Participates in the first searches and is labeled as cooperative.
13. Homeless man. Allegedly told law enforcement that he heard a scream at around 4:30 a.m.
reports concerning this man remain sketchy and unverified. Some say this character is completely fictitious.
14. Two girls. Allegedly two girls turned in LS's key and id.
15. Owner of a white truck. First police say there our a couple of vehicles in the area and they want to check out whether the owners know anything. Later photos of a white truck are released with the information that it was near the scene at 4:24 a.m. It apparently runs a stop sign and may have circled the block. Bloomington police then release a statement that the owner of the white truck has been identified and is not involved in the LS case. The identification of the driver of the truck remain private and are not released to public. No further mention is made of the other vehicles in the area.
16. Mr. and Mrs Spierer. Grieving parents. Almost weeks and still looking for their daughter.
17. Law Enforcement. Police have refused to release the last known videos of LS for reasons completely unknown. At least one person has been very critical of the investigation. (See 7-9-11 update for link.)
18. Garbageman. Dumpsters in the area are usually picked up by 8:00 a.m. The garbage is typically brought to a station and then trucked to the landfills. Not unusual for the garbage to be buried in the landfill before noon.
Keep in mind none of the above are suspects nor are they even necessarily "person's of interest."
I agree with Carrie. I count on you to discuss issues and opinions but keep us grounded in actual facts.
I know you attorneys don't accept any ads or money, so I hope you are content with our thanks.
(#5. House guest of JR. We have given this person the fictional identification of D.B. He might be a hometown guest visiting JR who could fill in some of the gaps missing from "play" as it currently might be written. Police have not released the name of the house guest or what if anything he knows about the early morning in question. So, what if anything does the mysterious house guest know about that morning?)
This is the one that bothers me and had from the time I first read about it, not sure if it was true or not at the time, so I looked elsewhere.
“IF” this is true than why has LE not mentioned this person as a POI?
And if it is not true why has LE not dispelled this as rumor?
In the Martha Moxley case it only took three people to derail the investigation, besides the people pulling the strings. The three were, two detectives that worked on the side as Skakel security…they destroyed evidence. And the prosecutor who took over the investigation pointing it to a new direction…like looking for a homeless vagrant who happened upon the murder weapon in the Skakel yard (a golf club), and lay in wait for Martha, even though he would have had no idea who lived at the residence and when they would pass by. All in a gated community with high security.
IMO…forget the dump, to risky for the type of people who may be involved. No need to take such a chance when it could be completely avoided.
VG you make some good points.
Who knows for sure if there was a house guest present? JR! and he is apparently not talking. But why???
This article reported that HT (Lauren's roommate) said that JR had a friend from home staying with him that night.
http://www.lohud.com/article/20110626/NEWS01/106260388/Lauren-Spierer-search-nets-few-leads
I still wonder whether or not it could have been a case of abduction by a stranger. There are other unsolved mysteries in Bloomington. No one has been arrested in the death of Crystal Grubb. http://www.theindychannel.com/news/25329879/detail.html BPD never discovered what became of Margaret Ann Hayes
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/h/hayes_margaret.html (Ted Bundy was active at that time - was he ruled out?)
Anonymous said...
I still wonder whether or not it could have been a case of abduction by a stranger. There are other unsolved mysteries in Bloomington. No one has been arrested in the death of Crystal Grubb.
Like the poster said above...this scenario just doesn't "smell right" with the action of the POI's. I've been involved in other discussions (which have been modded time and time again) where friends of the POI's have come forward with information early in the case that really points the finger to a certain group of people. I lean towards the scenario of born.in.btown regarding the possibility of DNA being present before she may have OD'd. That would hike the risk factor up tremendously in terms of calling 911 and letting the chips fall where they may.
dw06 & bornbtown: have very cognizable theories. Unfortunately, until there is a body we have no proof if let alone how much L.S. consumed of intoxicating substances.
How about Legal Pub organizing a search party?
Certainly readers couldn't be any less successful than predecessor searches.
"Logician said...
dw06 & bornbtown: have very cognizable theories. Unfortunately, until there is a body we have no proof if let alone how much L.S. consumed of intoxicating substances."
From what I have gathered from friends of POI's who came forward to a certain discussion forum early on, she had taken 2 if not more xanax bars, done coke and had been drinking. This wasn't her usual habits, but for some reason, this night she ventured into the extreme.
If she told the paper this she must have told LE as well…So why no mention of this guest as a POI when JR and CR are mentioned. He apparently would have been one of the last to see LS along with JR.
How did he arrive at that location…did he drive?
If so, why was it posted elsewhere that JR had no access to a vehicle?
It appears to me that someone is deliberately planting disinformation to waste time and funding. Like the rumor that JR did not have access to a vehicle would cause many to think if LS did OD at his place and he panicked and hid the body, it must be close by or in a dumpster, causing LE to waste time and effort following up that lead.
In the Moxley case the prosecutor lead the investigation to a nearby lake to be searched by saying an anonymous tip came in saying that part of the murder weapon would be found there…based on the homeless vagrant theory he created. The part of the murder weapon they were looking for was the head of the golf club that went missing from the crime scene. This golf head would have directly pointed the investigation to the Skakel household…$$$ talks and everyone has their price.
In my last post where I referred to "she"...She= HT and her statement about JR's guest from Mich.
What's in the Back of the Truck?
Around the time that Loren Spierer disappeared a truck was photographed by security cameras as it was heading westbound on 10th Street. The photograph shows Loren and her assailant in the back of the truck although many people see only a blur when they look at the picture.
The pictures shown here are to aid people in resolving these pictures. Some of the pictures are shown with outlines to aid the viewer in figuring them out. Adjustments in brightness and contrast are used to make the pictures clearer. Colorized images are also included.
http://eagleeyeview.weebly.com/
If a person has difficulty in perceiving these pictures they should put time and effort into grasping what's there and bringing it into focus.
Hawk: Quite a stretch. Besides why say assailant? They could be voluntary and snuggling.
I don't think anyone is shown in the truck bed. But asuming it was true, why would LE say the truck is not connected with the case?
V. G. The police have really said there are perhaps 10 POI. They have rarely specifically named any of them. Consequently no one should be surprised when LE doesn't mention anyone specifically by name.
What I don't get is why there is not more attention on the altercation. The altercation at Smallwood is the only known evidence of physical violence that early morning. Just what was the motivation for the dispute? Furthermore, it would appear that sometime after the altercation, LS would have walked by where the alleged puncher lives.
Why would they not search the alleged puncher's apartment complex and any vehicles that may have been accessible?
V. G. The police have really said there are perhaps 10 POI. They have rarely specifically named any of them. Consequently no one should be surprised when LE doesn't mention anyone specifically by name.
What I don't get is why there is not more attention on the altercation. The altercation at Smallwood is the only known evidence of physical violence that early morning. Just what was the motivation for the dispute? Furthermore, it would appear that sometime after the altercation, LS would have walked by where the alleged puncher lives.
Why would they not search the alleged puncher's apartment complex and any vehicles that may have been accessible?
Update July 13, 2011: SO WHERE IS NANCY GRACE? She crusaded so hard against the tot mom, Casey Anthony. The Anthony story is now a dead horse. Stop beating it and the jury to death. You show has a chance to demonstrate real investigatory journalism. Find Lauren Spierer! Nancy, accept the challenge and see if the truth can be uncovered irrespective of the money. The Speirer family needs closure and persons of interest need to be cleared of scrutiny. You know you need credibility (and ratings) after the Anthony debacle. The challenge: Show the world that NANCY GRACE has superior investigatory reporting skills and help BPD find Lauren.
Born.in Bton and Video Guy seem to have good theories. Course, still no public evidence as to those theories.
L.P. Fair challenge to Nancy Grace! The staff will likely relay the challenge if she does not read it herself. LOL.
No way Nancy Grace accepts the challenge. This would constitute real journalism instead of mere preaching on her high horse.
If she does, I will eat crow.
Come on, Nancy would rather harp on a jury who only did what they promised to do, follow the law.
Hope Fox or ABC jumps on the challenge instead.
Fair challenge. Someone makes sure the producers see it!
After Legal Pub's outline or cliff notes, if Nancy Grace does not take on this as a priority, I will lose all respect for CNN and its integrity in the journalism field.
What's the matter Nancy Grace, too tough for you?
Hey Nancy, You can contact Legal Pub at legalpub@legalpub.net if you need any additional background to get you up to speed.
I've also saved all 6 threads from PT and this blog with all comments in case "something" happens to them.
What the hell is this?
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=7030+Mount+Tabor+Road,+Ellettsville,+IN&hl=en&ll=39.253176,-86.613271&spn=0.010318,0.021865&sll=39.253267,-86.620624&sspn=0.005334,0.011791&gl=us&t=h&z=16&lci=com.google.webcams
Yeah, it's the crazy chick whose homeless friend got murdered, who figured out DB, and totally nailed BPD on that purse. I must be the craziest person in history bc it's like I can't even be wrong now if I want to. And you have no idea how much I do.
If I go to LE they'll move her. I know it. I can't even publicly enlist help bc of the previously-stated fear and I can't even figure out what that is but I am not remotely comfortable with it in the least.
Also, they have a relative who's in a certain law firm with the father of a certain BPD officer who was murdered on I think 5/28 and, like my homeless friend and CG, nobody cares or thinks it's untoward. It's my dad's law firm. Probably a coincidence but it might not be bc I don't know what I'm dealing with here.
What the hell do I do?
I've been following this tragedy since the onset and I know just about all the initials that are being used. All but one, that is. Will somebody please tell me what LE stands for. I cannot continue on with this case until I find out. Thank you for all your insight and info.
Law enforcement
"If I go to LE they'll move her. I know it. I can't even publicly enlist help bc of the previously-stated fear and I can't even figure out what that is but I am not remotely comfortable with it in the least."
I'm confused. What would you be going to LE with? Are you saying you know where Lauren is?
I'm equally confused
"Anonymous said...
What the hell is this?
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=7030+Mount+Tabor+Road,+Ellettsville,+IN&hl=en&ll=39.253176,-86.613271&spn=0.010318,0.021865&sll=39.253267,-86.620624&sspn=0.005334,0.011791&gl=us&t=h&z=16&lci=com.google.webcams"
So are you talking if you completely zoom in on this map, look at the very base of one of the first trees? Is that a friggin BODY there???? I can't totally tell and I've looked at this like four different times. But it looks like somebody is laying at the base of that tree.
Anon friend of Homeless.
One thing at a time. If you truly want to help, stick to facts that can be proven directly on point as to LS.
If you personally have threats made against you or fear for your life, call Attorney General Greg Zoeller. They have all sort of resources and will not back down as long as you remain factual and on point. If you allege theories or unproven facts, you are unlikely to be taken seriously.
If you think you know where she is, grab a friend/witness or two, a cell phone and go find her. Then call law enforcement from the scene and stay there til they arrive. No way anyone should touch anything.
It needs to be stated here that those Google Map images were probably taken many, many months ago, possibly years. I don't think there have been any new images taken in the last month. Does anyone here think so?
(The pictures shown here are to aid people in resolving these pictures. Some of the pictures are shown with outlines to aid the viewer in figuring them out.)
Hawk Eye; maaaan you are really pushing it there…I see nothing resembling those outlines. If I lay on my back and stare at the clouds rolling by I’m bound to see something I recognize in them…until I refocus my eyes and my peripheral vision.
What's in the Back of the Truck?
Around the time that Loren Spierer disappeared a truck was photographed by security cameras as it was heading westbound on 10th Street. The photograph shows Loren and her assailant in the back of the truck.
http://eagleeyeview.weebly.com/
Don't you see the colorized images? Observe that they have the same shading as the original picture and are a true representation of it.
As for Nancy Grace…send her an e-mail. I’m glad someone on the networks gets on these missing and murdered children cases and doesn’t let go, otherwise they would fade into the abyss…to bad she is so god-dam annoying! I don’t know why anyone would wish to appear on her show.
I didn’t know she was harping on the jury since I don’t watch her that much unless it is a breaking case. She needs to stop that as it is contributing to the death threats the jury is receiving that I’m hearing about.
As for the google maps, yes they are old. When researching the Shanda Sharer case for my videos I looked and many maps of the area and I can guarantee that the same maps are in use as the ones I used over three years ago…and they were probably a few years old back then.
And what is with the homeless guy and the screams he heard? At what exact location did he hear these screams and at what time?
And for you dumpster fans…they found that missing 8-year-boy from NY in a suitcase in a dumpster. The murderer led them to it so we don’t know if it would have been discovered without his help. Apparently this is the first time he has killed anyone (to early to tell) and he lives in an urban environment.
I don’t dispute that a dumpster is a common way to dispose of a body in an urban environment or in a panicked situation like an OD’ed person. Actually the statistics show this to be true. My theory is if LS OD’ed at the 5 North building there was advice given or even help that knew the risks of a dumpster disposal…the statistics also show that many are found this way…so she was taken elsewhere…JMO
And we should also consider that she willingly entered a vehicle for a ride home and was raped, murdered, and disposed of from this friendly driver.
Again what's the purpose of the map. Is there a story here or is this some random location that someone found and thought it looked creepy, cause there are millions just like this one. Also as a side note, I have seen google maps driving around indy several times over the last month or so. All these images like the map or the white pickup turn into Rorschach tests. U look at it long enough you'll start seeing anything.... not sure what my point is anymore, my mind went blank..lol. Just want to know what the map means.
(http://maps.google.com/maps?q=7030+Mount+Tabor+Road,+Ellettsville,+IN&hl=en&ll=39.253176,-86.613271&spn=0.010318,0.021865&sll=39.253267,-86.620624&sspn=0.005334,0.011791&gl=us&t=h&z=16&lci=com.google.webcams)
I see nothing unusual about the google map posted besides there is a white truck in the driveway where the marker is (west side of street). It is not a crew cab pick-up…it is a 2-door flatbed. If that is what you wish us to look at.
Not all that far from where Myers lived…ya think there’s something in the water out there?
Maybe it’s that address…some kind of consulting business there.
This is a Mobile/Manufactured located at 7030 North Mt Tabor Road, Ellettsville IN. The property was built in 1995...
So this is not the residence with the white truck as that residence has a fire place. Mobil home a few doors to the south.
The following is an edited comment. This is not a site to attack people.
Ok, Nobody threatened me, really. Just made a comment that seemed weird enough that it could arguably be perceived as such and I did perceive it as such. It was "you're an idiot" from an email address that bothered me. I could also just be paranoid about this for some irrational reason I can't identify. that house is spooky, the shed is somehow unacceptable to me and those people are ????? I don't like it that they're near my friends at all.
I think those webcam shots are old, so anything under a tree is probably nothing. I recently noted that a house I was looking at on Google maps had the same cars that were parked in front of it two years ago. And then took way too long to realize what a blonde thought that was. ...the fight is probably irrelevant but I think LE is hiding ZO and DR from us. DR might have even walked to CR's with Lauren, but I don't know what happened to him if he did. He definitely let those 2 into Smallwood.... check mycase.in.gov ...
I also think that, being who they are, they have a lot on LE and LE won't so much as look at them funny. ....
He's also probably the closest to her of all of them and their relationship was always platonic, as far as I can tell. I'm scared for him, really. ....I hope whoever talks throws the informants under the bus first. ...
LegalPub, LE will never find Lauren .... They do not want to be held to account for their actions and someone has to take the fall for waiting 3 days to issue the alert, which is hard for them to argue, since, officially, it was two days and Lauren's parents filed the report. ....
Forget Nancy Grace. ...
The homeless guy supposedly heard a scream at 4:35, which corroborates JR's timeline exactly. He was supposedly walking around, but I lived at Sunflower for 2 years and I swear I never saw him leave while it was dark out.
Regardless, he was right around 15th & Woodburn, so just a little north of the kids on 11th St. and the scream came from further west of him.
That leads me to believe that she was picked up in a car and probably killed ....
The homeless guy died 4 days after he came forward and I believe he was beaten to death... the Coroner said it was natural causes. ...
Video Guy, yeah. And who could make her get into a car without any fuss or her bolting barefoot bc he had no headlights when he rolled up on her? That's why I think handcuffs are involved. ......
...I believe it was day 4 when they issued the alert. ...I'm dealing in objective reality and BPD is ... working a timeline in which it's always yesterday. How do you reconcile that?
... And I can't see any endgame...
... Can anyone explain to me how I'm wrong about anything without dealing entirely in logical fallacies and with extreme prejudice against me? ... I just want a level playing field...
I found DB ...
And again, forget Nancy Grace. ...
A couple general points: while posters enjoy freedom of speech, on this board if you state an opinion, you need to clearly state it is your opinion and not necessarily facts. Second, a post can't attack an individual or invite litigation.
If these rules aren't followed, comment regretfully will have to be suspended.
Anon, Really admire your persistence, but you need to be careful what you post. Please don't attack individuals. You have your own site to do as you will.
Edited comment:
I do not want to go over to that house. I sincerely hope I talked my friend out of doing that because she's fearless and it scares me. It's someone's property. I could probably make them get a warrant...
Yeah, never mind.
I thought you guys might want to be Americans, place the burden of proof on the State, and not indulge the perpetrators' thoroughly insulting crime against humanity Part II that is the case of the world that voluntarily disappeared Lauren Spierer out of intellectual laziness and a total inability to separate fact from self-implicating nonsense.
...God help us all.
Anon: the last thing any one at Legal Pub wants is for an innocent person to be punished for a crime.
If everyone focuses on finding LS, then perhaps we will learn whether a crime was even committed. Up at Purdue, it was discovered that there was no crime. Something similar could have happen with LS.
An unknown abductor has also not been ruled out. There is nothing wrong with wanting to learn the truth and holding others to a standard of searching for the truth. However, this site is not an appropriate place to attack individuals.
Someone at TG posted this comment: "Anyone reading this who gave info to BPD early on and thought they’d done their part. please send that same info to the PO Box. Just no telling who’s really involved in Lauren’s disappearance.”
Well, I read it and posted my own comment on another site, and I'd like to share it with LP:
I may be going out on a limb here, but I think it’s right before our eyes and we’re not seeing it. Odds are 10 to 1 that the police patrolling the area (and I know they do, I've seen them) had to see her stumbling around and/or falling down and might have been keeping an eye out for her. She was pretty messed up, from what I’ve read.
Suppose on her way home at 4:30, or earlier, like after 3:38... they moved in for the public intoxication arrest, or for whatever reason, and given her heart condition and all the narcotics swimming around in her blood, for heaven’s sake!! Just how much would it take to make her heart go silent? Besides being scared of another bust!
Maybe it went silent in a patrol car, or with a member of the LE, maybe at the bar, maybe someone was trying to help her (a lot of maybe's here, I know), but why on earth wouldn’t they have called paramedics?? Because of a law suit?! A little foul play?! Serving a minor?
That little girl’s body may be hidden somewhere out of the search party’s areas, the boys (her ‘friends’) have been told to be silent, OR they simply DO NOT KNOW! If they're guilty of anything, it would be of supplying the stuff in the first place. That would be enough to keep them silent, wouldn't it?
They're 'lawyered up' now and are supposedly passing Lie Dectector tests. HOW? Maybe because they're not guilty. So why was LE in such a hurry to get the video tapes out of Smallwood? Why won't they show videos or release names/identities? Why are we so aggravated with them? Why, why, why...and the list goes on. I’ve read it all and had many thoughts and ideas, but it’s just too bizzare that nothing has come to the forefront after all this time, because they ONLY let out what they want us to know!
I’m glad that the Speirers are setting up a PO Box. Let’s see if that info might reach different eyes first.
P.O. If this is boggling my mind like this, and possibly all of your's also, then just imagine what it's doing to her family! I WANT IT TO BE SOLVED! Bring in the big boys!
(Video Guy, yeah. And who could make her get into a car without any fuss or her bolting barefoot bc he had no headlights when he rolled up on her? That's why I think handcuffs are involved.)
I know I was being vague, but I was in no way insinuating that BPD are running around killing women. As a mater of fact, if she was picked up for public intoxication and started to OD while in the car I have no doubt that they would have taken her straight to the hospital…and saved her life.
Jules303…I have read that the Speirers have also hired a PI to help, so there will be another independent set of eyes on this thing if true.
Should we post an e-mail address here and at the other blogs for the Nancy Grace show and encourage all to write her daily?
JuleS: Until LS is found, neither your nor ANON Edited's theories can be ruled out. However, based on my experience, Video Guy is correct in that mos officers would take her to the hospital before any booking for public intox. Furthermore, they would take her to the hospital if she collapsed.
Fear of lawsuits are generally not an issue. One, the city and P.D. are immune from most actions and generally insured from the rest.
Now, could an off duty police/bouncer be involved? Anything is possible, but again not likely. Bouncer/cops would most likely call an ambulance or transport to a hospital.
The homeless man's hearing a scream remains a wild card in this investigation. If accurate, it narrows the time frame substantially.
Something Video Guy pointed out early on was the presence of so much construction in the area. If LS was truly impaired that night, it is not hard to believe that she suddently deviated from her path to Smallwood. For this reason, perhaps the early searches were too narrow. She could have been a victim of an accident or abduction.
LE knows much more about this investigation then they have released to the public. They apparently have strong beliefs and some evidence to support their beliefs. They will not likely call a grand jury without a body and a known cause of death. The Casey Anthony trial will make all investigators and prosecutors more cautious. And with our fundamental principles of justice, caution is a good thing.
Update July 14, 2011: Still no hint of Nancy Grace getting involved. Feel free to contact her. LINK in update. For those frustrated with the pace of the investigation, keep in mind the following:
~ You can only protect your liberties in this world by protecting the other man's freedom. You can only be free if I am free. ~Clarence Darrow.
~ I have always found that mercy bears richer fruits than strict justice. ~Abraham Lincoln.
~ It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.~William Blackstone.
(Bet some of you thought Jimmy Voyles said all these things first. LOL.)
I read a tweet by Chick Justin about L.P.
Personally, I think L.P. is being very fair to all involved. When and if there becomes evidence of a person or entity responsible, I suspect that L.P. will likely unleash a fury that even Chick Justice can be proud of.
But right now, I side with L.P. and caution is warranted. Thus evidence and facts not unproven allegations.
Ditto:
Keep up the good work.
Truly appreciate your dedication to a cause where you don't have a financial stake.
L.P. Will you and others return to Bloomington any time soon?
Gosh! Yes, I went out on a limb and you all did a good job of bringing me back to the trunk. I just had to get some things off my mind. Your replies were courteous and well thought out. Thank you...but it will remain in the dark recesses of my mind that LE knows more than they're letting on. Until a body is found all we can do is share thoughts and ideas. I know where I can go now if I have something I need to get off my mind.
This blogger may be going out on a limb, but since we are throwing around all info and trying to look at it objectively, I found this interesting. The astrologer describes a route around campus that can be traced by that map that was posted earlier by the person who thought BPD was in on it. Also, she states the direction the body was taken is in the same direction as 7030 N Mt Tabor Rd Ellettsville,IN 47429. This address is also mapquested to be a little under 10 miles from UI campus. It's interesting...I am not totally convinced by astrology but the details here are very coincidental.
Maybe it's time Nancy Grace got off of Casey Anthony and get on this case..Enough Nancy, Casey Anthony is what it is and it's over..Focus on LS..
L.P. may visit again in Bloomington real soon. What we really need is for Video Guy to get motivated and video tape her supposed route and then try to get video interviews with H.T. the Spierers, A.A. and those willing to openly discuss what they know.
V.G. does wonderful videography and it may actually help find LS.
Search "Forensic Astrologer Lauren Spierer"
DW, interesting astrology, something we don't deal with in the court system. Also noticed a comment from a medium on that forum about a shed near a generator or construction...
Everyone was asked to check their sheds so unless someone missed something...
The abduction of the young Jewish boy in New York reminds us to never close the door on a possible unknown abductor, but in L.S. case, if JR is correct, then the window of opportunity is very narrow...
(What we really need is for Video Guy to get motivated and video tape her supposed route and then try to get video interviews with H.T. the Spierers, A.A. and those willing to openly discuss what they know.)
Motivation is not the problem… There is no way anyone will go on record on camera and tell us more than what we have read. I think the blogs are more informative at this point because anyone with information can post anony and not worry about repercussions. I think Legal would be more successful if this next visit Legal tries to talk in confidence with these people and establish a relationship, without a video camera in their face. If something evolves from this and is worth a video, and approved by the other party…then we should consider video. BTW, I do things by the book and have people sign releases, as to why one does not see Toni Lawrence or Hope Rippey’s images in my videos…but it doesn’t mean I don’t have such images….not saying I do, but I could.
As for the route: Some guy walks the entire route and has it on youtube already. He is on camera as well babbling something about the BPD and drugs and alcohol, and why pot should be legal…and so on. But the video does do a good job of covering her route from Kilroys to 11th and College. I would have added some aerial maps to the video to give viewers reference points.
(V.G. does wonderful videography and it may actually help find LS.)
IDK if it will help, maybe to keep this story/case alive but it might be to soon for this, and would need more planning. Don’t get me wrong, my focus finger is itching and I would love to search around B-town with Legal, camera in hand, as I have a few places I would like to investigate as well. I would also consider it a treat to meet Legal in person as I do admire the work put into this blog over the years…and thank you for you complement on my video skills and what can be accomplishes with zero budget and an idea…on the fly.
V.G. You must be good for L.P. to say so...
I agree. No one is going to say anything. I think it best to rent a helicopter and fly over the route and show the outlaying rural areas.
But if she got in a car, she could be anywhere!
"Edited comment:
I do not want to go over to that house. I sincerely hope I talked my friend out of doing that because she's fearless and it scares me. It's someone's property. I could probably make them get a warrant..."
Anon: what house are you talking about? Are you talking about the address in Elletesville?
Uriah Clouse
http://eattheapplefromthetree.blogspot.com/
Interesting article...
Great article, very insightful!
I don't know much about the Behrman matter, but I recognise a well written article.
I have read the Jill Behrman court transcripts in their entirety and one can find them at Bloomipedia. While reading them I also did research on the internet, reading other points of view and looking at maps…the maps are very important as well as experience in bicycling with this case. Fifteen years ago I use to ride like Jill did and probably why I felt an alliance to her story.
People make a big deal about where her bike was found and how could she have had time to ride back home, clean up and make it to work a 12:30 pm…and I say this was an easy ride for Jill, a stretch of the legs, and the state proved this with a female cyclist of Jill’s capabilities. Her bike was found some 12-15 miles from her home and was reported being seen in the ditch along side the road between 10:00-10:30 AM. Jill could keep an average pace of 18-20 MPH…and that means just that, in an hour she can travel 18 miles.
Also, and this is very important, I seen the photos and read about the damage to Jill’s bike…and that bike was NOT hit by a vehicle! There is no way possible to hit a bicycle with a vehicle and not damage the wheels, and this bike had no wheel damage. The damage to that bike was similar to my bike when I went off the trail while racing another cyclist and my speed was close to 18 mph. I was also temporarily knocked out from the fall (I did not have a helmet). I firmly believe that Myers forced Jill of the road with his vehicle and into the ditch while she was traveling at 16-20 mph. And she was probable stunned by the fall and easy to overpower.
I also feel that these alternative theory’s are disinformation produced by Myers family as they want him out of prison. Read the transcripts and you will find this family, as the jury did, argumentive, rude and almost hostile. WHY ? Because over the years they themselves have voiced opinions to others that John Myers was guilty of this crime…but denied this in court, even though there were witnesses to this. And it was more than just the grandmother saying this, as the family would like you to believe.
John’s mother is in denial, or doesn’t care that John was on his way to kidnap and probably murder his x-girlfriend that day when he came upon Jill. John’s X had a restraining order against him at the time and had to altar her schedule because he was stalking her.
Prior to this he took his X to the exact obscure location Jill was found late at night trying to convince her to go back out with him, and she was scared to death he would kill her that night, right then and there, as he had been abusive to her in the past. John held his X in confinement at his trailer on an earlier date by stripping her of her cloths and threats of violence…Jill’s cloths were never found, and neighbors testified that blankets were placed up on the windows of Johns trailer the afternoon of Jill’s disappearance and stayed up for a week.
As one reads about John you will see he is a violent control freak with a temper. The very next day after Jill’s disappearance his father AND mother both suspected John of this crime…they know their son. If John is ever released there is a good chance he will kill again once he gets pissed off…it is what he is. And it could be your sister or daughter the next time…
Update July 15, 2011: It has been said that silence breeds contempt. In this case, silence breeds speculation. One of the theories bantered about is that someone gave LS a "date rape drug." Such a drug is any chemical that can assist in the execution of a sex crime, typically a sedative or hypnotic which tends to induce amnesia. "Drink spiking"is when the substance is added to a drink for amusement or malicious intent (robbery, battery, sexual assault etc). The concept is not new. For centuries, alcohol has incapacitated individuals and lowered inhibitions.
In-gestation of such substances can be voluntary or involuntary. The most common substances are alcohol, benodiazepines (flunitrazepam, midazolam, temazepam or rohupnol) and GHB (gamma-hydroxybutyric acid). Alcohol remains the most common substance used in large part because of its availability and acceptability. Furthermore, most victims willing consume the alcohol. However, even if an intoxicated victim agrees to sex, it can still be considered "rape" due to the lack of ability to consent. A limited example would be having sex with someone who has passed out. Respiratory depression, coma and even death are real possibilities when someone ingests a date rape drug, especially if mixed with alcohol. In the case of LS we have no real evidence other than she was at a bar drinking alcohol and her movements on video which apparently depict her conduct. Despite the limited evidence, it appears to be a safe assumption that she was intoxicated. But to what extent?
with v. g on the Behrman case.
L.P. could info on "date rape' drugs. Did not realize alcohol was the most common substance involved in "date rape" accusations.
(However, even if an intoxicated victim agrees to sex, it can still be considered "rape" due to the lack of ability to consent.)
This statement incriminates 80% of the male population of rape on any given weekend.
I agree that alcohol will loosen people up to sex, but that includes both sexes...there are many males who have sex with females they normally wouldn't because of alcohols effects, combined with the flirtatious advances of such women...the term "coyote ugly" comes to mind as one would be willing to chew off their own arm to get away the next day when sober. And I'm sure it works both ways.
I've read all this.. my problem with the case and with the 5 North gang is how much time did they have to hide or dispose of her, I mean really. That's why I sometimes have doubt it was one of them. If it was JR she can't be far from campus?? Where the "F" is she? Might be time to waterboard, jk
(how much time did they have to hide or dispose of her)
From 3AM on... police didn't even go there until Sat.
That is true but if it's a college kid kinda hard to hide someone for several days without looking to weird and someone not noticing, probably not the case here but the thought runs through my mind. Of course if they had help you can throw those thoughts out. I don't know, Indiana has a horrible track record of finding missing people in a timely fashion.
And as a crazy techno side-note, if the military has this technology:
http://www.product-reviews.net/2011/03/17/us-soldiers-to-get-igd-army-deploy-individual-gunshot-detectors/
Why can't they engineer some type of device that is car mounted that picks up the scent of decay, don't laugh :). That's how they made shark repellent. They reversed engineered the smell of shark decay, sharks hate the smell of their own kind of decay. I'm sure this device could pick up very small traces when it's airborne. Think how bad a dead skunk smells. Yes it would be a large amount of ground to cover but it may speed up the process... i'm just saying. Could be a neat little invention, and no I'm not crazy.lol
Here is a link to a video showing one of the people discussed in regards to this case and the stranger throwing Lauren over their shoulder at 3:38 AM:
http://www.twitvid.com/W6E4F
I don't even think this person is a POI except for the mysterious stranger encounter by an unknown witness.
My point is, that these kids are posting so much info on the Internet anony that any video at this point would be out of date and probably wrong in a week.
What strangely has been missing is added info about JR and his house guest.
(They reversed engineered the smell of shark decay, sharks hate the smell of their own kind of decay.)
I didn’t know this and I find it interesting.
(Why can't they engineer some type of device that is car mounted that picks up the scent of decay… Think how bad a dead skunk smells. Yes it would be a large amount of ground to cover but it may speed up the process... i'm just saying. Could be a neat little invention, and no I'm not crazy.lol )
NO…you are not crazy and that is an interesting thought.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2011/07/15/2011-07-15_i_just_cant_stand_to_see_something_like_this_happening_in_our_community_how_his_.html
I don't believe every one of her theories, but the chick at http://www.twitvid.com/W6E4F
makes some interesting arguments. If she would just present them without the attacks, she would have to be a force to be acknowledged by BPD.
503, I agree with you. She is tenacious. IF she would just stick to the facts she could get more people to listen.
Guess I am #504
» madame • Fri Jul 15, 2011 05:00 PM
in the small word of new york jews i heard today that they had (at some point in the past) found the pants lauren was wearing that day on train tracks. anyone hear anything about that?
From PT
Very interesting! Read post #402
http://www.justicequest.net/forums/showthread.php?p=772430
@Videoguy Law enforcement can see 11th St. from the Waffle House which they inhabit. Just saying.
@LegalEagle They denied me a restraining order for 18 months as set-up because the guy had no business being in the country, let alone grad school, or middle school, given his intelligence. He followed me down a staircase at Ballantine at 10:00 pm 1 month before my last class at IU. Nobody who didn't have to watch a 4-hour Italian film had any reason to be in that building. He was such an indefensible human being that even IUPD had to tell the judge on the record. The judge found it hilarious, enabling my murder because I hadn't already been physically attacked.
I have a 9, a Flipcam, and a Twitter account. The free market of public opinion and sunlight are all that stand in my favor at this point.
Freaky: I posted that map of those freaks and I don't believe in astrology, if only for the same reason I can't believe BPD: they are not working on a timeline which could even arguably exist in objective reality.
Also, my MA in linguistics w/ a specialization in computer-mediated communication with a strong interest in identity halfway retroactively explains how I found Bleznak. It was through a picture on Phantasy Tours which is apparently hilarious in conjunction with LS, it's so old and irrelevant. It led me to Bleznak and I can prove it was him in court with these networks. 2000 locked-up Facebook accounts, an irrelevant picture, and Rosenbaum in Barcelona - down to 1 in an hour. I didn't even know what I was looking for and only became aware of the Runcible Spoon tweet, which I fortunately grabbed because I had his timeline open in another tab and actually didn't notice it, was totally news to me. He deleted it when I tagged him on Twitpic.
I also care about Rosenbaum far more than I can begin to explain. I spent days crying my eyes out at the thought of him in that jail with that MCSD officer who passed a note framing John Myers, who is illiterate, and more unsavory than I care to go into.
I think I'm Tallboy II with a home and a future. But never a watch in my life. LOL. If you don't know that Tallboy is real from the Herald Times thrice over and general chatter, because everyone knew him or had at least seen him around, God help you. He's the kind of guy you say hi to, not cross the street from.
I find the mere suggestion that the man who I brought dinner every night for two years never existed to be unfathomably insulting, and not on my own behalf. He was real, and he still is. He's Bloomington's guardian angel who stepped up and did the right thing, saving 3 more kids from that horrible snakepit just like he saved me.
They're going down for all of them if it's the last thing I do. And anyone who suggests that north of the bridge on College is shady is too hopelessly stupid to understand that 6/3 was a real day which actually happened.
@Madame - not a stitch on Jill Behrman or Crystal Grubb. Or sexual assault in CG's case. JB was bones when they "found" her.
The MO is absolutely identical, given every fact we have on Lauren so far. She was strangled.
She was abducted in the alley between 9th and 10th. You can't stand in the spot where she was abducted without almost seeing it behind your eyes or having any doubt where it happened. I drove over there to check it out after I'd long since decided this based on maps of the area. I had to pull myself together for a good 10 minutes before I was prepared to go stand there on my own two feet.
Swear to God.
@VideoGuy You should see the documents I just know his family sent out anonymously. You can't read the GJ docs & think it could be Myers on your life or that he wasn't 100% set up.
Show me a legitimate motive and a smoking gun. He's shady, but also unarguably waaaaay too stupid to pull that off.
BPD may be small time, but I don't think they have intentionally botched the investigation. Normally, the investigation would focus on JR and JW. But because of all the information and disinformation, they can't just focus on these two because of the rumors concerning DB, ZO, AB and the mystery man.
As a result, without DNA and cause of death, a grand jury would not be helpful at this point.
BTW...BPD has said that they have yet to search the dump. According to TG's blog
(Show me a legitimate motive and a smoking gun. He's (Myers) shady, but also unarguably waaaaay too stupid to pull that off.)
Smoking gun…for me, and I’m sure the jury, it was the phone calls from Myers trailer that day combined with the blankets put up on his windows, seen by a county worker that passed by that trailer several times a day due to her job, never obstructions in the windows before, but by 11 AM the blankets were up and stayed for a week. Also, his car was parked behind the trailer on a wooded drive (hidden) in a place he had never parked before that day, or after.
He may be dumb but his dad was a sheriff police, so he knew a few things about police procedure.
Phone calls…In the morning before Jills disappearance he is calling state parks, soon after her abduction (based on when witnesses seen her bike alongside the road), He is calling local theaters. Who the hell was he going to take to the show? He had no one! And why call a show at 10:40 in the morning? Because he did know that there would not be an answer from the theater since the show times are recorded, thus giving him documentation that he was acting normally…his dad’s a cop and he knows this to be important. He was also a petty thief and is familiar with the process of creating alibis. He doesn’t make another phone call from his residence until that evening.
MO…He (Myers) was heartbroken, depressed, and love sick. His neurons were not firing properly and not only was his X not interested in him anymore, causing this physical illness, she took things to the next level and pressed charges against him. In his mind, they were to be married. He had been stalking her and had probably seen her with another, and if he can’t have her no one can.
On the morning of Jills disappearance Myers had already convinced himself that he would kidnap and kill his X, and was prepared to do it as he had taken that week off of work to accomplish this. He had gone through specific parts of this plan in the month’s prior but failed to follow through. He tricked her into visiting him and than held her against her will for a weekend, he convinced her to talk with him again and took her to the secluded location Jill was found, but she talked her way out of it…this time he will not fail as he knows the relationship is now over…and so is his life as he knows it. The pain he is feeling is enormous and he is actually physically ill and mentally imprisoned as every moment is spent thinking of her.
Myers knows his X’s schedule and is determined to pull this off today. He called the state parks since he knows he will be the prime suspect, and this will cause LE to search the wrong locations. He leaves for his X’s house prepared with his shotgun, rope, and duct tape. What he doesn’t know is that his X has altered her schedule because of him, and his plan is foiled. On his return journey home he is angry, very angry as he has failed again, and probably screaming and pounding the dash as he drives. Jill’s cycling route that day just happened to intersect the direct route between Myers trailer and his X’s home, and on Myers return journey he drives up upon Jill from behind...continued
Many motorist consider cyclists a nuisance and on this morning Myers is in no mood to be considerate. “GET OFF THE ROAD YOU FU*KEN BITCH”, as he swerves his car at Jill while passing her. Abduction of Jill was not his first intentions. In his rearview mirror he sees Jill ride into the ditch and tumble and fall in a haze of dust. For a moment compassion trickles into his thoughts and he stops, backs up and pulls into the field entrance across the road from Jill. When he walks up on Jill he is apologetic, Jill is stunned, hurt and begins to scream at him, telling him the trouble he will get into for this…she will see to that since she knows his action were intentional.
This is the breaking point for Myers, another disrespectful bitch ready to fu*k up his life, and this one may actually send him to jail combined with the other charges he has. He than attacks Jill, punching and beating her, his rage built up over months. He knows he cannot leave her there and he is mentally prepared to kill, he is in a familiar environment with nobody around and has the tools to fulfill an abduction, so he drags her to his car where she is quickly bound and gagged…than off to his trailer.
This whole event, from the time Myers first forced Jill off the road until she is restrained in his car takes 5-7 minutes.
He parks his car in the drive behind his trailer and brings Jill in from this way, through the small wooden area. His car is hidden so no one will know he is home. Once inside he places the blankets up on the windows and thinks to make the phone calls to the theatre…his alibi, as he knows the bike will soon be found.
...Shall I go on??
I think it was Equisearch http://www.equisearch.com/ not Equifax (the credit reporting company) that came to search for Lauren.
(not a stitch on Jill Behrman or Crystal Grubb. Or sexual assault in CG's case. JB was bones when they "found" her.
The MO is absolutely identical, given every fact we have on Lauren so far. She was strangled.)
Jill was not strangled, she died from a shotgun blast to the back of the head right where her skull was found…pellets in the ground beneath as well as in the skull. They have the forensics to back this up…including the “Wad”, proving it was at point blank range. If John Myers used the same M.O. on Jill he used on his X when he stripped her of her cloths and forced himself sexually on her the weekend he confined her…than Jill was most certainly raped.
In short; Myers M.O is an organized petty criminal with a controlling personality, prone to impulsive violent outbursts when dominance is lost. In my last post I should have used the word Motive along with M.O.
(I think it was Equisearch http://www.equisearch.com/ not Equifax (the credit reporting company) that came to search for Lauren.)
It was, and their going to sue Casey Anthony for wasting their time.
Wonder why they have waited this long to search the dumps?
Think dumpsters were emptied that friday a.m.
There is unconfirmed rumor that pants were found by R.R. track. This could have thrown BPD off track.
(Think dumpsters were emptied that friday a.m.)
Thats what I thought, now someone who looked up the garbage pick-up for the area says the pick-ups are on Tuesday...If true, than Lauren would have been discovered if placed in a local dumpster as they were searching such places on the following Sunday.
(He's (Myers) shady, but also unarguably waaaaay too stupid to pull that off.)
He stole from most every employer he worked for and got away with furnishing his trailer from a furniture manufacturer he worked for…he is criminally intelligent.
He didn’t “pull it off” as he is in prison right now for it and was a POI by the first week of Jill’s disappearance. LE probably would had put more pressure on him in the beginning had his father not worked for the county jail and even more had Jills body been found earlier.
Don't know who researched the trash but the dumpsters near 5 north were emptied friday morning before 8 a.m.
Don't need research, just watch.
Found this:
Lauren's cousins - who should have an idea what's going on should know the pulse of the immediate family -- are on repeatedly tweeting "PLZ RT! BPD is 2 cheap 2 rule out TerreHaute Landfill! Spread the word! Need2 rule it out #FindLauren" (@amspierer and espierer)
@VideoGuy Not to make this about Jill Behrman, and I didn't intend to derail the thread, but her hyoid was crushed. That does not happen accidentally to a 19-year-old. She was admittedly stabbed and shot post-mortem.
Myers also consistently failed at petty shoplifting. His phone calls are a rock-solid alibi.
okay... but this is about Lauren Spierer.
It is about Lauren! abductions...possibly...by who? Drugs were involved...yes...follow the drugs...read about the Michael Myers court documents. Those people are still around...they have a very long felony crimal record...major drugs flow into B-town from Chicago and Detroit. Those kids involved are from these areas. There is a pattern...must find the link...not proven but a possible cover up for whatever reason could be going on. There was previous drug raids on 2 of the homes of these kids, but where is the court documents????
no paper trail because innocent unless proven guilty. no proof of guilt.
there is proof...it is just a matter of time until it is discovered...
Jdamn
(I didn't intend to derail the thread, but her hyoid was crushed. That does not happen accidentally to a 19-year-old. She was admittedly stabbed and shot post-mortem.)
Jill Behrman is not off topic as the reason I looked into her case was because of the assumption of some that there was a serial killer working the area and Lauren may have become a victim of this person. (and some still think so)
At first Myers looked to be victim of a wrongful conviction to me (look at my earlier posts) So I attacked it like I would a video project and spent at least 40-60 hrs researching it. All I can say to you is read the transcripts, all 5000 pages of them…this caused me to do a 180 degree change on my first assumption. Especially pay attention to the forensics you CSI fans, this is how it is really done. Her hyoid was not crushed…it was never found, nether were her feet, hands and other small bones because animals dragged them away. But they did recover enough of her skeleton, especially around the vital organs, to determined she was not stabbed. No knife wounds (bone scaring) were found on the ribs, spine, scull…wrists, or anywhere. Just her shattered scull from the shotgun blast that was glued back together. (did you not read my post about the shotgun pellets found and the wadding? Or just choose to ignore this evidence).
As a matter of fact, they wanted to make sure she was not stabbed as that was the rumor floating around since the first month of the investigation, along with her being hit by a car. If your going to debate the Behrman case, facts and critical thinking are necessary….not the crap Myers mother is putting out there as I have read her site as well, and noticed when people were posting with facts pointing to John’s guilt, the comments were shut down. Or I would have posted a few myself.
BTW…she wasn’t shot post-mortem, why would someone do that? Use your critical thinking and logic. Besides, the forensics explains why they believe she was shot while alive by the way the scull shattered. It has to do with the gasses released during the gunshot and the backpressure. Did you know that at close range the gasses inter the victim before the projectile? And even more so with a shotgun….something I did not know before
And I have read about this Uriah Clouse…yes he is a serial rapist and may kill someone if he hasn’t already. But look at his victims ages, 13, 14, 15 yrs old. That is what he likes, young girls in puberty. Jill would have not been to his taste, or preferred victim. And I’d like to see someone place him near the area of Jills disappearance at the time as Myers was. Not sure where I read this since his name was brought up by the defense in the transcripts, but I think he was incarcerated or house arrest, or something like that during the time of Jill’s disappearance. I do know he was a POI and was dismissed.
What I’m trying to do here is debunk the rumors with facts that a serial personality is working the B-town area that may have taken Lauren. Process of elimination so we can focus on the other evidence that points to the 5 North building.
(major drugs flow into B-town from Chicago and Detroit. Those kids involved are from these areas. There is a pattern...must find the link...not proven but a possible cover up for whatever reason could be going on.)
I’m not discarding this at all, if so I’m leaning toward Mich as the source…and this supposedly houseguest of JR’s as possible involvement. And it may not be about the drugs themselves, except for the OD’ing of Lauren and her use of them that could be connected to JR, that will lead to the houseguest, that will lead to a cover-up from Mich.
And it could be something complete different regarding this houseguest…something more sinister. I would like to know what his female classmates felt about him in High School. Like, was he aggressive sexually, far more than the acceptable norm?
I’m not accusing, just pointing avenues of interest that should be pursued by LE.
VG no confirmation there is a house guest let alone that he had anything to do with lauren disappearing.
And it could be something complete different regarding this houseguest…something more sinister. I would like to know what his female classmates felt about him in High School. Like, was he aggressive sexually, far more than the acceptable norm?
I’m not accusing, just pointing avenues of interest that should be pursued by LE.
I went to Cranbrook and my family lives in the same neighborhood as DB's. Both DB and JR were the nicest guys in high school. They were well liked and popular.
Sorry, I forgot to use () around your comment VG.
Get the word out that the following facebook forum was created for Lauren Spierer:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/208180112562676
(VG no confirmation there is a house guest let alone that he had anything to do with lauren disappearing.)
True...But HT spoke about this guest in her first interviews that I consider most reliable at this point...less likely to be tainted should someone be pressuring these young people to be silent, as many of them are now doing.
Even Tony G's witness who seen the mysterious scene at 9th and College has refused to talk with him any longer. He feels someone got to her/him
(I went to Cranbrook and my family lives in the same neighborhood as DB's. Both DB and JR were the nicest guys in high school. They were well liked and popular.)
Hummmm...I guess it would be safe to say you are in the camp of a "stranger abduction" or "The boyfriend did it". And don't think Lauren OD'ed and her body hid away or tossed in the trash??
Can you confirm if DB was or was not there that morning?
This case is our countries Natalie Holoway. It will haunt everyone here in this country until the facts about her disappearance are uncovered.
To the Cranbook alum:
If you would like to anonomously share your observations with Legal Pub, we would like to interview you by email. If your interested about sharing your high school recollection about JR, contact:
legalpub@legalpub.net
We like all sides of a story and would welcome good or bad stories about JR.
Update 7-20-11: Many responses have been offered concerning the land fill controversy. One supporter of the BPD pointed out that on 6-18 a massive search was conducted in Martinsville based on a tip. LINK. Furthermore, if there is any truth to the growing rumor that the 4:15 a.m. call may not have originated in Bloomington, then there may be rhyme to their reasoning. Police are not corroborating any rumor, but if the origin of the call was traced to a place other than Bloomington, then the failure to immediately search the Pimento landfill may be justified.
This is a FB group that is called Lauren Spierer: Case Discussion. I would encourage you all to go over there and be added as there are 6 Spierer's (family members) in the group- and the Uncle is talking- http://www.facebook.com/groups/208180112562676?ap=1
Tell the owner of the Facebook that we have posted their link and encourage all too visit their Facebook.
Searching the landfill is a good idea and should have been done immediately.
A landfill search is how the body of child murder victim Somer Thompson was discovered:
http://crime.about.com/od/current/a/somer_thompson.htm
Legal said:
(if there is any truth to the growing rumor that the 4:15 a.m. call may not have originated in Bloomington,)
Whoa…that would change everything! Of course all we have is HT’s word that JR told her he or Lauren made that call….that’s like 3rd person info to begin with. But than again it is JR’s statement that he was at 5 North when he watched Lauren turn the corner at about 4:30 AM, and if his phone puts him 20 miles away at 4:15 AM…than he has a problem. I can’t believe he would be so dumb as to use his own phone while disposing of Laurens body, (If that is the case here we can expect to see his face on a worlds dumbest criminal show). Than again, he is 20yrs old and allegedly consuming every drug in B-town that night…must have been sniffing glue too. I wonder what other calls were made from that phone that morning and to who.
Allegedly, JR’s alleged houseguest was having breakfast in B-town at 10AM…if this rumor is true I can’t help but think how Shanda Sharer’s young killers went to McDonalds and ate well after disposing of her body…all that killing sure works up an appetite. I’m guessing that stomping around the woods while dragging a dead body around would generate a hefty one as well.
If this is true…god job with the research Legal and we would now know who is responsible, and so will the world very soon. Would this be enough for BPD to drag JR’s ass back to B-town for further questioning?
(This is a FB group that is called Lauren Spierer: Case Discussion. I would encourage you all to go over there and be added as there are 6 Spierer's (family members) in the group- and the Uncle is talking)
Well, I don't have a facebook account and don't want one...any way they could make the account public so the antisocial social network types like me can read it?
and as I told Legal in a privet message about a month ago...they need to search the Morgan Monroe State Forest.
Especially since the Mich and Indy-town people would use route 37 going to and from B-town and would look like a good, vast, secure place to hide something to an out-of-town'er...though I had a different POI at the time, it appears to be even more relevant at this time.
And while looking intensively at the satellite maps a month ago, I found two locations not that far off Rt 37 to the east.
Right off Rt 37 in-between exits for W. Burma Rd and W. Bryants Creek Rd, about 1500 feet south of Bryants Creek, there is a trail entrance from the northbound lanes, right after a guardrail. This trailhead leads east into the woods about 2500 feet deep. It appears to be well used but very secluded. I doubt _____ would know of this place unless he was there before, but would have noticed it if traveled Rt 37 north…NOTE: there is a cell phone tower at Burma Rd & Rt 37.
10-15 min drive from the 5 North area
I think _______ took W. Bryants Creek Rd east by SE until he came across the cleared trail for the high tension towers, about 2 miles down. Can pull of the road to the north or south and drive to the north further in from the road. To the south the creek would stop him from venturing in any further than about ten yards and a good place to hide Lauren around the creek, but far to close to the road. To the north he could stop anywhere up the trail within reason of a cars capabilities and carry Lauren into the woods, a SUV would have no problem driving in further.
15-20 min drive from the 5 North area.
just seems like too much work for any of these alleged POI. Basically these are lazy kids. IF they were involved, the body would be disposed of in the trash or someplace near.
Just too much work to find a great spot.
Update 7-21-11: Most missing people don't generate a great deal of media coverage. LINK. So what? This one did. So what is the media going to do to help find Lauren? One word of advice, try to be a leader and not a follower! Go interview the cell phone provider. Get a quote for exactly how much the search of the landfill will cost. Do it today!
TRUST ME! People in Indiana have not forgotten about Lauren. Billboards are everywhere with her face on it.
So, keep the pressure on law enforcement and the media to get answers. L.P. suggests interviews with phone personnel. Where did the phones of everyone ping. This information should be discoverable.
Get a cost on a landfill search. Then raise the need for donations if the BPD can't afford the dig.
L.P. Good point. Any story about LS stumbling is old news and assumed along time ago. Now I get your 7-15-11 expose on intoxicating beverages and potential date rape etc.
Since alcohol is the number one substance, any one who got with LS that night might face scrutiny.
Any one who served her alcohol or drugs could also be in trouble.
I can see why everyone has clammed up...
Wish BPD would release a little more of what they have. I understand why they haven't, but all we have at the moment is rumors and our own theories. Quickly turning into a very very cold case.
I would wager that the Cranbrook alum is A. T., totally solid dude in Michigan who lets me follow him on Twitter.
So it turns out - once again, undisputably, simply because of the undeniable cover-up on the part of BPD - that JR had a ...informant...
http://twitpic.com/5tsvpw
Also, State Trooper ... has gone down the memory hole since Lauren's disappearance...She's in Ellettsville. Still.
http://newsonlaurens.blogspot.com/2011/07/day-50-letter-from-charlene.html
If the video confirms Lauren stumbling around Smallwood with CR, why is any one shocked? Does someone who is not under the influence of some intoxicating substance leave shoes, cell phone and perhaps a coat elsewhere? LS likely lacked capacity to knowingly consent to anything. (An intoxicated person lacks capacity to consume more alcohol, take drugs, or have sex.) Re-read Legal Pub 7-15-11 update. Now, do you really still wonder why some folks might not be too eager to volunteer information leading to her discovery? Find the body and the rest will follow...
An open letter from Mrs. Spierer is linked in today's update as well as in the comment before this one.
We are shocked because of the sparse info LE has let out, their main focus was on that silly time line, which they contend they stick by because they have video to prove it!! WELL...why did they let on that Lauren was helping CR out of elevator, out the door, and on the route home (Lauren F. Nightingale) because he was hit so hard that he lost memory and couldn't function properly! GIVE ME A BREAK!! I never belived this. (My younger son has been hit so many times, and hard, but he never lost memory, even when drunk!) Why has it been crammed down our throats that Lauren helped CR to his room and MB helped put him to bed! Ha! Ha! Ha! The joke's on us! So NOW we're reading, via the NY media, I might add, that the video shows a very drunk LS stumbling and CR helping her out of Smallwood and over to his place!! THAT's why we're surpised. The person who says he can't remember anything has GUILT written all over him. I'm telling you, the reason the landfill hasn't been searched is because they (LE) know she's not there! DUH! (Definition of duh: too obvious for words!)
http://www.indystar.com/article/20110722/NEWS/107220349/New-details-emerge-Lauren-Spierer-case?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|IndyStar.com
I shouldn't have typed that it was CR that helped her up and out...according to this, it was a male companion... "She comes stumbling out of the elevator, trips several times toward the corner of the lobby, where she comes to rest in the corner of the lobby, falls to her knees and leans against the wall for support until a male companion comes to her aid, gathers her under his arm and escorts her out of the front of the building," the source said. "That whole sequence lasts less than 60 seconds."
A male companion, possibly the same person seen in the video in the alley! Geez! Whom are they protecting?
(Why has it been crammed down our throats that Lauren helped CR to his room and MB helped put him to bed! Ha! Ha! Ha! The joke's on us!)
Than why would JR admit to being the last to see Lauren, putting himself on the chopping block? Unless you are suggesting that all 3-4 of these guys had something to do with disposing of her…and maybe something worse.
(I'm telling you, the reason the landfill hasn't been searched is because they (LE) know she's not there! DUH!)
Or else that is exactly where she is…Why has it not been searched thus far? Why the excuse of no funding to search there? Who controls the funding? When your talking about things like special funding this is a request that goes well above the investigating officers control of the case…were talking political people here.
Find out who approves such funding and it will take us to the people who wish to hamper this investigation…if that is what is happening here. My guess is it will lead to someone that needs your vote to continue their career…they always have their hands on the purse strings.
Mrs. Spierer speaks: An open letter from Mrs. Spierer may be found here: LINK on main page.
Jessie Wolff speaks: A reporter from Journal News has apparently decided to step out of the shadows of the followers and has tried to contact JW. Wolff finally responded today via Facebook, urging "Leave me alone please." Wolff added, "I spoke with the detectives Tuesday and have taken a polygraph. All my cards are out on the table ..." According to this article, when asked whether police administered the polygraph, and for the results, Wolff replied, "what the (expletive) do you think the results were? if i failed a polygraph everyone in the world would know ...." LINK on main page
I read Lauren’s mother’s letter…This is truly heartbreaking.
I also thing she is being way to reasonable with the people of interest. Anyone that would throw a person they knew in the trash (if that is what happened) like a piece of garbage has some serious moral issues, and is psychotic.
So lets look at the POI’s again and what kind of environment they came from that would encourage this type of sociopath behavior. We know some are filthy rich and those type of people have little respect for others and feel a since of entitlement. So how did they acquire their wealth, smart business decisions, inheritance, or by crooked means?
One of the POI’s that sticks out in my mind is the family that has become extremely wealthy through foreclosures. Bottom feeders that prey and profit from the hardships of others, throwing families, children, even babies out of their homes and onto the street for the all mighty bottom line…people are numbers to be crunched. Can you imagine the environment their child was brought up to believe in, what kind of table talk was held at the dinner table? I imagine those are the type of people more likely to raise their sprods to believe that other humans are here for their pleasure and profit…and more likely to raise a sociopath that would throw another human in the trash than try to save their life, had they needed such help. And more likely to drug and incapacitate a pretty young girl to take advantage of her…it fits the family profile.
And such people would have an extremely good reason, no matter what the costs, to cover up such actions as the public would respond with total rage should they learn their privileged offspring were running around tossing young girls into dumpsters after taking advantage of them…especially the millions who have lost their homes through foreclosures.
They have one choice now that this case has drawn so much attention, and that is to fall on their sword and give up their deranged offspring to save the family. Because when Lauren is found, and she will be, the lynch mob at the Casey Anthony trial will seem tame compared the what they will experience…and the whole family will experience this outrage…so better they do the right thing now before Lauren is found and they are presented as the sum they really are.
Video Guy...I am a usually a composed, normal acting kind of person, but when I get online and start reading new news and info, I get a furious fire burning inside. I should compose myself even more before I start typing a comment. NOW, my big question is: Who helped her up in the lobby of the apt bldg? and why walk her out the door instead of up to her apt where there may be people, roommates, who can help her? Maybe even put HER to bed? I guess if they had taken her to her room, we'd all be doing something else with our own lives right now, but I'm obsessed with this. Some days I don't turn on the PC because I know I'll get involved. With all the videos, the LE know WAY much more that we do, so why leave us hanging like this and feeding us contradicting info? They know exactly who helped her up and walked her to the other apts.
Now I'm going to take a shower and go pick up my son and granddaughter and drive to Vincennes to see the new Winnie-the-Pooh movie! I'm going to try to regain some normalcy. My heart literally aches for the Spierer Family! As do all of yours, I'm sure. I watch my little granddaughter like a hawk these days, now that I've been turned on to all the missing girls!
(Wolff replied, "what the (expletive) do you think the results were? if i failed a polygraph everyone in the world would know ....)
I don’t think JW did it…I was suspicious of him in the beginning as many were, until I found out how he was behaving at 8:00AM Friday morning. There is no way this young guy would be acting completely normal had he just came back from accidentally killing his G-friend of two years and hiding her body…a girl he knew since childhood. I think his sudden decision to leave town was a good choice now as he and his friends would have probably kicked the living shit out of CR and his spoiled friends JR and the houseguest. (now that’s a fight I’d love to see and video tape…the moral lesson is beyond comparison)
His seclusion once back at home was most likely a result of depression than of guilt, we are not talking about a Ted Bundy kind of person here.
(My heart literally aches for the Spierer Family! As do all of yours, I'm sure. I watch my little granddaughter like a hawk these days, now that I've been turned on to all the missing girls!)
You have to and that is sad...but what you also have to do is pay attention to what happens to such deranged people after they are caught and sentenced for their cruel crimes...the odds are some goody-two-shoe organization will be fighting to get them out of prison early as what happened with Shanda Sharer's killers.
No one was paying attention and Hope Rippey was released under the radar, than when Melinda tried people were ready from what happened with Hope and signed petitions, made phone calls, created videos (thank you very much), and blogged, blogged, blogged.
Jules: enjoy the movie. this saga will still be going on when you log in tomorrow or even the next day.
video guy: yup, no one is going to roll over and play dead on this one.
If I were Jw I would be open from the beginning... I would have spoke to media, help organize search parties... I could go on.
Not to say he is involved, just saying I don't think his post 6-3 actions are not how i would have handled it.
Way to implicate yourself, scrubbing Parker's 6/10 statement about having scrubbed the landfill. You're going down with Tonsing and Zaltsberg.
Idiots. She's in Ellettsville on the property of a scrubbed State Trooper.
(Not to say he is involved, just saying I don't think his post 6-3 actions are not how i would have handled it.)
If my girlfriend had ended up missing I’d like to think/know I’d have stayed in town to help in any way I could, I also know me and my friends would have found CR and started to pound on him…so it be best for JW to leave town. What has been said about the second confrontation is that it WAS JW and some friends at the 5 North building later on Friday confronting some of the occupants. If true, it looks to me like a concerned boyfriends actions and not one who was involved with foul play. Besides him driving a roommate to class at 8 AM acting completely normal, a roommate that would have nothing to gain for lying about it. LE prob has video of this trip to class.
(Idiots. She's in Ellettsville on the property of a scrubbed State Trooper.)
I looked up the address you were posting before and it is not a house but a trailer, and a consulting business is run from there.
So what are you saying, that she is buried there or held captive? If held captive...why?
Amy Winehouse was found dead in her home...ask me why I'm not surprised!
who the hell are you? go investigate!!
If JW did it, why does BPD's obstruction of justice log skip 6/3 entirely and have the Spierers reporting Lauren missing on 6/4, even though JW did so on 6/3? They set him up and jacked his alibi just to keep him from testifying about they purse they had already planned on planting (probably not twice, though) hours before he reported her missing. This is, of course, impossible for him to prove, since Lauren Spierer was never officially reported missing and has no missing person's report.
And if Legal Pub weren't 100% complicit in 5 murders this would have been public knowledge weeks ago.
I'm chickjustin with too many dang Google accounts, apparently. What do you think I've been doing 24/7 since I heard about Lauren & MCSD's kiddie pr0n ring bust on 6/6?
Taking down all those monsters, which entails bringing in inspectors general and at least 4 exhumations.
And a landfill search for the other key witness they murdered.
no public record of the IG. is the landfill search a go?
(And if Legal Pub weren't 100% complicit in 5 murders this would have been public knowledge weeks ago.)
So their in on it too...I thought I might be next when they invited me to B-town to shoot video about this case...I was thinking they were going to inject me with drugs and throw me in a dumpster....C'mon!
What do you mean by "Scrubbed"? I'm not familiar with that term.
One should always be cautious and not rush to judgment. Read: http://legalpublication.blogspot.com/2008/07/legal-pub-cautions-not-to-rush-to.html
In my opinion, when a prosecutor basis charges upon public and media pressure instead of actually what he can prove, the legal system starts to break down.
L.P.
Long time reader. One word that describes you is FAIR. Keep up the good fight.
jdamn or chickjustin, or whoever you are today, why do you keep speaking in riddles? Tell us what you know straight up, You're already everywhere and everyone's reading you and you're starting to get more recognition, so...do the right thing. If you really believe all this bizarre info, go to someone you can trust. I want to listen to you, and give you the time of day, but sometimes you make it hard for us and we end up thinking you're just another crazy chick running around with your head cut off! ACT ON YOUR INFO!
Scrubbing is the act of throwing once-reported facts down the memory hole, invariably and definitionally implicating oneself in whatever one seeks to cover up.
No rush to judgment. No judgment required at all. 2 + 2 = 4.
@jules303 I think today is the day my blog goes back up, my technical idiocy permitting, of course.
By the way, everyone, Road Dog's real name is Franklin D. Crawford. I'm also also pretty sure that the other homeless key witness who they murdered is what they're hiding in the landfill.
Ahhhhhh, disinformation + cover-up = scrubbing. Guess that's why an image of Nixon flashed before my eyes when reading you definition… …Thanks jdamn
I think chickjustin is trying to say she/he has no evidence because of scrubbing…so it must now be gathered again.
VG, I am chickjustin. i just have two different Google accounts - one for my email and one for youtube - and I just post w/ whichever one I'm logged into.
I have about 37 gigs of scrubbed news stories, social media posts, video which later became damning, etc.
I actually just realized that BPD told another outrageous lie on the record on 6/9. they said that everyone who talked to her that night was a POI, but David Rohn could never have been a POI because I have video of him talking to Russ McQuaid during a search, talking about all the land he'd scoured. he was with her from at least midnight until 3. Remember, before the battering rams at Smallwood, Lauren walked around with two women, who then became two men, after she had gone to Smallwood as of the real Day 5.
And again, if LP weren't undisputable accomplices at this point, that informant's off-the-chain sketchy mycase.in.gov file would have long since been dissected at length.
Still not admitting that Bill Parker stated on the record that they had searched the landfill already on 6/10, huh?
And how are the DOGS?
Oh, look how stupid and blood-soaked LP is:
http://www.thedailygreenburgh.com/neighbors/spierer-case-appear-americas-most-wanted
Justin ..., otherwise known as argylesandcigarettes, chickjustin,et al has an MA in Linguisitics. She is very intelligent, but she (may have) a history of mental illness... Her repeated postings are leading this conversation far off course. There is no basis for her conspiracy theories. I feel comfortable posting her real name since she used it to post unstable messages on the BPD facebook which led the comment section to be disabled this week. (But the editors removed her full name as that is not relevant to the discussion.)
Edited Anon:
Justin may be a bit out there, but she does point out valid areas for inquiry as to inconsistencies. Conspiracy no... but some explaining may be in order by law enforcement.
To All:
What about the St John lady who allegedly had dogs that hit on the dumpster and behind the dumpster? How come no publicity about that until today?
Doesn't it reenforce the need for a landfill search?
I don't think law enforcement puts much credence in St John's magical dogs.
(I don't think law enforcement puts much credence in St John's magical dogs.)
LOL…nor do I. What many people who choose to believe in Physic powers don’t realize is that there are actually schools for this that claim they can develop this raw skill in many...(for a fee) What they actually teach is how to read people and their reactions to a base line of questions. Everyone who sees such a person is usually there for a few reasons.
I meet a girl who was attending one of these schools and she offered to give me a reading, (for a small fee of course). So I asked her, “If you can tell me things about my future, than you must be able to tell me things about my past...So tell me something”. And her reply; “It doesn’t work like that.”
How can it not? Since logic will tell us if one can tap into the future or sprits who know me/them, they must know about my past, or be able to tap into the same source that looks to the future.
I see this as an excuse to avoid verifiable information proving them wrong. At the end of our conversation she told be I could not be read since I’m a skeptic, and that would block any Physic vibrations...Or what can be otherwise defined as; I’m not a sucker!
just to follow up on what another poster mentioned regarding a certain well-known commenter on this board. this person does have some credibility issues and/or mental health issues. this person's time and effort can't be questioned, but the accusations are not helpful, and in many cases, dots are connected where there are no connections ... and sometimes not even any dots. it is hard to say where the truth ends and the other stuff begins. so read with caution.
By the way, anyone who goes ad hominem or straw man after or on his 5th birthday is mentally deficient by definition. See: DSM IV
Anonymous II, don't blame me for your own illiteracy. If you can't keep up or even understand that 6/3 was a real day, then somehow blame me for your own idiocy, that's called "psychopathy." Maybe after a few weeks of hard work you'll manage to sound it out. It IS a whole 4 syllables.
And on what planet does the burden of proof fall on the individual, anyway? Planet Gulag, I guess.
Identifying posters by names or calling out another poster is not appropriate at Legal Pub. Inviting litigation or threatening litigation is not appropriate conduct. The comment section is designed to share opinions on the Lauren Spierer disappearance. Please keep to the topic.
Update 7-26-11: A break in the case or another distraction? Six blocks away from where Lauren Spierer disappeared, Meredith Ephlin, an IU student, reports that a man attempted to strangle her. The 34 year old woman was apparently walking to a convenience store near 17th and Woodburn when she was attacked. At the current time, law enforcement is downplaying any possible relationship to the Spierer disappearance. LINK on front page.
hi, long time lurker here. Just wanted to say in regards to the "psychic" is that her cadaver dogs hit the same place as the polices cadaver dogs. I think that is a huge bit of information whether or not you believe in psychics. this information is on the LS: case discussion fb page. The dogs also hit by the dumpster where she was last seen.
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